Was Woodrow Wilson a true Christian… or just a politician who used religion for power?
In this episode of Christian or Not, we dig into the faith of America’s 28th president. He was the son of a Presbyterian minister, a man who prayed daily, quoted Scripture, and claimed his policies were guided by God. He has a PhD and was president of Princeton college.
But was his Christianity genuine, or was it carefully crafted for the public stage?
We examine:
- Woodrow Wilson's earlier Christian background
- How his faith shaped (or failed to shape) his progressive policies and view of government
- The uncomfortable contradictions between his public Christianity and his private actions
- What his own writings and decisions reveal about the state of his soul
Was Woodrow Wilson a man of God… or a man who used God?
Watch now and decide for yourself.
00:00 --> 00:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Christian or not is a production of Revive Studios.
00:06 --> 00:11 [SPEAKER_01]: America has had only one US president that had a PhD, which I was surprised by.
00:12 --> 00:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't thinking that all of them had PhDs, but I would have assumed it would be more than just one.
00:17 --> 00:23 [SPEAKER_01]: This one president is also one of the most on paper Christian presidents you would have ever seen.
00:23 --> 00:30 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, in his presidency is opponents slandered him because there was a story that when he got some
00:36 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_01]: But the people of America, we're not swayed by that and we're not bothered by that to then that was a sign of a faithful Christian president.
00:43 --> 00:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Before he was president, he spoke at Chapples, before he was president, he spoke at YMCA's.
00:50 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, he was considered one of the best preachers many people heard in an age where Charles Spurgeon and some of the best preachers that ever lived were preaching, people
01:04 --> 01:13 [SPEAKER_01]: this guy on paper looks like he should be the most Christian president that the United States ever had and it should be on paper.
01:13 --> 01:23 [SPEAKER_01]: This should be a slam dunk Christian or not shouldn't even be including his name and yet Woodrow Wilson is one of the most controversial presidency.
01:27 --> 01:33 [SPEAKER_01]: or you have heard his name and you're already spitting mad because you know the legacy that he left behind.
01:34 --> 01:43 [SPEAKER_01]: But the question for us today is not, well, not necessarily everything about his legacy, though we will talk much about what he did as president of the United States.
01:43 --> 01:46 [SPEAKER_01]: The question for us on this show is, was he a Christian or not?
01:53 --> 01:53 [SPEAKER_01]: My name is Troy.
01:54 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And my name is Mark, and this is Christian or not, where we talk about famous people from history, talk about just some of their biography, what did they do?
02:03 --> 02:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Why are they famous?
02:04 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Why do we know them?
02:05 --> 02:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Why are we talking about the monoboc cast?
02:07 --> 02:16 [SPEAKER_00]: And then we want to answer the question, where they Christian are not, like usually these people are known for being Christians or not, like very obvious not.
02:17 --> 02:23 [SPEAKER_00]: But we usually pick the ones that you would think are, and maybe they really are, or maybe they're not.
02:24 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Mark and Troy are you trying to judge people?
02:27 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, in the way yes, but of course we can't see the hearts of me.
02:30 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I tried laughing now because we try to do this in every time and try to make this, you know, a good nuanced intro.
02:36 --> 02:39 [SPEAKER_00]: If you've been following the show, this is episode six, you know, this intro by now.
02:40 --> 02:41 [SPEAKER_00]: If not, you're the first time here.
02:41 --> 02:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the channel.
02:42 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Listen to the other five as well.
02:47 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, we know we cannot see the hearts of men, only God can do that.
02:51 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_00]: But we can see the fruits and we just want to look at like, okay, but if this person was a Christian, a Christian business man, a Christian music composer, a Christian scientist, like how would that show in their lives?
03:05 --> 03:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And we've already set this in the previous episodes as well.
03:08 --> 03:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's starting to turn
03:10 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_00]: theology, slash discipleship kind of show because we're trying to identify these things like, okay, but what are those identifiers of a follower of Christ?
03:19 --> 03:27 [SPEAKER_00]: What are those things like, if you are a famous scientist and known for all these things with what would be things that we see in your life that would actually,
03:27 --> 03:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Pointless to like, oh, but you're also like really a follower of Christ or if you are a pirate even, we did a pirate, we did a Francis Drake, fire to the Spanish hero to the British.
03:39 --> 03:40 [SPEAKER_00]: We did Charlemagne.
03:40 --> 03:49 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's really trying to see also within the context of your time because, you know, very different days to see like, okay, where day a Christian are not.
03:50 --> 03:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And today, it's
03:52 --> 04:10 [SPEAKER_00]: a slightly different try night we try to work on scripts both of us, but as soon as we started working on this ID, I remember Troy mentioning the name of Woodrow Wilson, someone I do not know, but he said, I want to put him in, like I want to talk about this guy because so many people think he's a great guy.
04:11 --> 04:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And maybe I'm spoiling it a little bit, but I think you got it from you and throw Troy, not a woodrow Wilson fan.
04:17 --> 04:20 [SPEAKER_01]: No, so normally I try not to, I mean, we do kind of put our song on the scale.
04:20 --> 04:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We do kind of put our beliefs on display as we go through the story, but we do usually save the Christianish part kind of as we go.
04:27 --> 04:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But again, if you know the name wouldrow Wilson, there's really nothing else, like if that's someone you're familiar with, you're probably familiar with his incredibly not good legacy on the world.
04:36 --> 04:38 [SPEAKER_01]: There are some people who will hear the story and go, what do you talk about?
04:38 --> 04:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I heard in the US history class, it was a nice guy.
04:40 --> 04:45 [SPEAKER_01]: But most people who are familiar with this name today are aware of why not good legacy.
04:45 --> 04:51 [SPEAKER_01]: What surprised me so much was how much of his story does look good on paper.
04:51 --> 04:57 [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, I would say almost as if he had never become president, but he was just an elder at your church.
04:58 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I don't know that you would have ever, you would look at him as probably a pretty good guy as probably a couple parts that you would definitely stand out.
05:04 --> 05:07 [SPEAKER_01]: But I would have that you wouldn't probably made a good elder at a lot of churches.
05:07 --> 05:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So, was it they became president and he was able to practice a bunch of things that he was keeping hidden?
05:11 --> 05:12 [SPEAKER_01]: What does it mean?
05:12 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_01]: A is a very complex man in terms of he shouldn't be what he is.
05:17 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I-
05:19 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it's naive, but it's someone who reads my, I read my Bible every day.
05:22 --> 05:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I pray with God every day.
05:23 --> 05:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I know it's not my works to save me.
05:24 --> 05:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It's Christ to save me.
05:25 --> 05:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's his work on the cost, but it is also undeniable that walking close with the Lord reading scripture, following God has a huge impact on my spiritual life.
05:34 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And when people ask me, how can I grow closer to God?
05:36 --> 05:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I say, well, you know, are you reading your Bible, are you praying, or are you spending time with him?
05:40 --> 05:45 [SPEAKER_00]: because we assume that those things should help your walk with God.
05:45 --> 05:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And what you're a Wilson is the first case of a guy, and we need to the first case of a guy.
05:50 --> 05:52 [SPEAKER_01]: We definitely need a case of a guy on paper.
05:52 --> 06:00 [SPEAKER_01]: He's doing everything he's supposed to be doing, but in practice, wow, is he making decisions that will hurt a whole lot of people?
06:01 --> 06:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and what they do about the show that Christian are not like it was as you were talking and just kind of maybe think of it's like I look at Christian are not and it's making me ask the question like if someone was looking at my life to a junior year from now like what would they be looking at it to see whether I actually meant my faith or not and I think that's kind of like what we're doing like.
06:19 --> 06:36 [SPEAKER_01]: the challenge from these shows should hopefully be as you go like oh man if I am a Christian I need to be so outwardly so just I hope that I am so outwardly explaining the love and faith I have in Jesus that 200 years from now that's a very short episode of Christian are not for me It's for you like that there really is pretty obvious with these guys
06:37 --> 06:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope that they're not just sitting there wrestling.
06:38 --> 06:41 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, well, you had all this stuff got wrong too.
06:41 --> 06:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's what we're going to do.
06:43 --> 06:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But let's start with Woodrow.
06:45 --> 06:52 [SPEAKER_01]: He's born in the 1800s and he, and sometimes I also refer to him as America's most post millennial Christian.
06:52 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll kind of break that down.
06:53 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_01]: But he had a very firm idea that would be that the G, that Jesus Christ was making this world progressively into a better place.
07:02 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And you will see that kind of play out in his beliefs here.
07:05 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, he's, he's had this really big idea here that he's very young and he kind of grows up in the faties of the Presbyterian, uh, background.
07:12 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of strong, good, Christian things happening.
07:15 --> 07:27 [SPEAKER_01]: His dad is faithful and his life and his family even takes in, uh, another famous Christian from that time, um, the Maiton family, J. Grush and Maiton is a very famous Christian with early 1900s.
07:28 --> 07:34 [SPEAKER_01]: and his uncle will actually kind of go when he's having some trouble, will actually go to Woodrow Wilson's family.
07:34 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been time with them.
07:35 --> 07:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So they'll be really close for a life.
07:37 --> 07:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So a very famous Christian man, J. Greshamachin.
07:40 --> 07:42 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll consider Woodrow Wilson and his friends are quite a long time.
07:43 --> 07:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he has these deep connections with Christian people, a lot of Christian people that people alive today really look up to.
07:50 --> 07:52 [SPEAKER_01]: They're still reading their books and they're still thinking of these guys.
07:52 --> 07:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really solid guys, which again makes it all the more mysterious that Woodrow Wilson would appear from this group of people.
08:00 --> 08:00 [SPEAKER_01]: If you imagine
08:02 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_01]: a seminary or a Christian school or a Christian Bible college or something like that out there.
08:07 --> 08:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And all these really great guys come from that place, but then this one guy comes out and everything he does is kind of like what happened there.
08:14 --> 08:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's still friends with all the other guys.
08:15 --> 08:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It does make you go, okay, what's going on with these people?
08:19 --> 08:21 [SPEAKER_01]: There's something just very odd in his story, that's different.
08:22 --> 08:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But as a young man, one thing that was very, very important to him was politics.
08:27 --> 08:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And you may say, hmm.
08:29 --> 08:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe that's why he became president, you know, like, you have followers trees.
08:34 --> 08:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Glad you're on New Road, you're asked.
08:36 --> 08:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe he wouldn't have said I want to be president, but he would have been like, yeah, I'm really into the idea.
08:40 --> 08:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And we see this, I believe it's his own father that goes off to be like, in sub being the governor of New Jersey or something.
08:45 --> 08:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
08:46 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it was Jay Gresham, Mechan's father, who becomes governor of New Jersey.
08:50 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_01]: So like, he's friends with these people who are in politics and stuff like that as well.
08:54 --> 08:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, they're all interconnected.
08:55 --> 08:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's growing up in these environments where
08:58 --> 09:20 [SPEAKER_01]: politics you're sitting at the table and you're talking about the days news but the days news are people you kind of know you know it's a friend of a friend and a relative of the uncle here and there so you're feeling deeply connected so it's not surprising to me but he he had these released firm beliefs including like in a very young age he said quote like his life should be about quote promoting the moral intellectual and physical improvement of
09:20 --> 09:21 [SPEAKER_01]: is fellow man.
09:21 --> 09:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Another quote he said is you do this, how do you do that?
09:24 --> 09:42 [SPEAKER_01]: So if your life is supposed to be promoting the physical moral improvement of people, well you do that by quote following the example and obeying the precepts of Christ and everything you do, and if you do that you will quote raise the general prosperity of all classes of society and increase the sum of happiness and virtue in quote
09:42 --> 10:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not hearing the evil just yet that you're saying towards like, what did I lose you somewhat about an instant follow dotter so far everything looks so good on the hyper he seems like it and you can say they say well it's a little wordy it's a little philosophical but come on if you're running Sunday school with a bunch of like teenagers or you know young college age people and someone says you know I'm gonna make my life gold promote the the raising up of people by follow me in Jesus.
10:08 --> 10:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're going to think that guy's great.
10:09 --> 10:20 [SPEAKER_00]: That's sad that, I mean, so far, nothing for me or I mean, this episode and the viewers listeners are going to notice like this is more me sitting on the sideline asking some of these questions.
10:20 --> 10:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So one question right now, like,
10:24 --> 10:26 [SPEAKER_00]: What era are we in?
10:26 --> 10:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I know it's like late early late 1800s.
10:28 --> 10:29 [SPEAKER_00]: So not yet late 1800s.
10:29 --> 10:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, he'll become the give me an idea his he becomes president in 1912 and he will become the president of Princeton around I think it's 1900 or 1900 for so he's kind of like this is kind of like it mid to late 1800s era.
10:43 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_00]: So it would put in like his sort of like Formative years like his grown that was like right after his civil war, right?
10:49 --> 11:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I was at say his earliest memory is when Abraham Lincoln was made president He heard some people saying America is going to war and he says he ran home and said dad I heard Abraham Lincoln became president and America's gonna go to war and his dad was like, yeah Actually, uh, like he's going to happen now because Abraham Lincoln became president in a couple months later The war kind of kicks off
11:10 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_01]: But that was like his earliest memory as this idea like America's going to war Which again if that's the world you're growing up and you can see my politics will be such a big deal Your earliest memory is a political moment that led to always the whole country rip the country I have which by the way if you're wondering which side of that divide would your Wilson and family were on firmly south
11:30 --> 11:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, his dad, a Presbyterian minister helped create the Presbyterian Confederate churches as the Presbyterian Church split during this time.
11:39 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_01]: They created, he helped, like, wasn't the only guy, but he was a part of helping to sound the southern side of that.
11:45 --> 11:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They were firmly, um, in that camp.
11:48 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And now, Marky may be concerned that did their own slaves know, they rented them from the church.
11:55 --> 12:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So the church owned the end would read one out to people and the Wilson family rented their slave.
12:00 --> 12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Where did what are these here?
12:03 --> 12:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just trying to grasp the concept, like was this like a money making?
12:08 --> 12:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I was keen for the hair to know and I look when I think of renting something I'm old and I don't remember going to a blockbuster where you would pick a video off and it sounds pretty gross to imagine that as I'm going to rent a slave and then when I think of the churches the people running at that.
12:23 --> 12:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It does not make me feel good.
12:24 --> 12:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I have some concerns.
12:26 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me put it like that.
12:26 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_00]: If my church was doing this, I would probably send in a strongly worded letter with me to the elders.
12:31 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he said, his discussions like, hey, maybe we shouldn't read people, you know, I don't know.
12:36 --> 12:37 [SPEAKER_01]: It's some firm ideas out of there.
12:38 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm, and so, and again, when the Civil War is breaks out, the Wilson Taley is saying, like, whoa, whoa, we're on the keep going with this side of things.
12:46 --> 12:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They're very pro, the South.
12:48 --> 12:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And in fact, Woodrow Wilson, when he gets elected, he will be the first
12:51 --> 12:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's Southern President elected since the Civil War era because of the firm feelings against it.
12:57 --> 13:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And the Democrats, after the Civil War, don't win very many presidencies because they were on the wrong side of that Civil War.
13:05 --> 13:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And he will also, he will be the first Democrat president elected when he becomes president because he'll be the first in over 20 years.
13:12 --> 13:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he's kind of a, and we will get what he stands for.
13:15 --> 13:17 [SPEAKER_01]: He's kind of a return of that era in many ways.
13:17 --> 13:22 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a confusing thing to me still because it would be follow like the news right now.
13:22 --> 13:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it's always Democrats, progressives, liberals, and Republicans are like the conservatives.
13:30 --> 13:34 [SPEAKER_00]: But back in the day, it was Flip arriving or how did that work?
13:34 --> 13:43 [SPEAKER_01]: So the Republican Party was created to fight slavery, Abraham Lincoln's entire one of this biggest platform positions was we're going to in slavery, it was an abolition party.
13:44 --> 13:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And so there was never a time when the Republican Party was like, hey, let's put people in the slavery.
13:49 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_01]: That was never their thing.
13:52 --> 13:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how it, I've heard, we're not a politics podcast, so we won't get into all the discussions.
13:59 --> 14:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just trying to be to understand here from there.
14:01 --> 14:06 [SPEAKER_01]: But I do think it's important to clarify because I'm sure we have listeners all around the world we're going to be hearing this and
14:06 --> 14:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I cannot tell you, I mean, times I meet people overseas who they're like, wait, no, the Democrats were the pro-slayer side of that and you're like, yes, actually, like they were inside the pro.
14:17 --> 14:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I just wanted to meet two because when the 1964 civil rights legislation gets passed, Lyndon B. Johnson will sign it.
14:23 --> 14:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It will be passed and they'll be like the Democrats passed it.
14:25 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, well, the Democrats joined the Republicans in passing it, but they were fighting against the other Democrats that voted against it, like all the people who voted
14:36 --> 14:45 [SPEAKER_01]: were Democrats, all the people who vote, all the Republicans voted for it, and that a few Democrats joined to get it to pass through Congress to then be signed by a Democrat president.
14:45 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So yes, Democrats signed it, but it was also the Democrats who kept it from being signed and that they had to go up against it.
14:52 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_01]: That makes it.
14:52 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm learning new stuff here about, there you go, American politics, the
14:57 --> 15:14 [SPEAKER_01]: it's a it's an issue that has again it's just always been odd to me how that became murky and I and I think people like Woodrow Wilson are a part of this story where they it wouldn't if you've just gone to basic history class you've just learned a little bit about him and you're not going to know what we're about to talk about because
15:15 --> 15:18 [SPEAKER_01]: This very important part of his legacy is left out.
15:18 --> 15:22 [SPEAKER_01]: If you've done research kind of outside that, then what we're about to get to, doesn't surprise you.
15:23 --> 15:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Back to him, at the age of 20, he writes an essay called Christ's Army.
15:27 --> 15:30 [SPEAKER_01]: And I for one can't remember any of the theological essays I wrote.
15:30 --> 15:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Actually, I do when I was about somebody had to write essay in Bible College on Jan Huss.
15:35 --> 15:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I had to pick a guy from church history.
15:37 --> 15:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and it was really, I was like, this guy's an amazing guy.
15:40 --> 15:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think actually, part of the reason I love church history was that paper.
15:43 --> 15:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know what, maybe those papers, we write when we're in our 20s to better.
15:47 --> 15:48 [SPEAKER_01]: You wouldn't know that anymore.
15:48 --> 15:52 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're a younger listener, you're going that paper, chat, GPT writes for me matters.
15:52 --> 15:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It does, actually.
15:53 --> 15:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but he, he imagined life as a war between good and evil that played out around us every day.
15:59 --> 16:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's full of these kind of quotes of seeing that you're, if you're a Christian or a part of Christ Army fighting this war against Satan all around you.
16:06 --> 16:15 [SPEAKER_01]: One of the quotes, uh, is because of how we're supposed to quail the with before the offlip the sword to the spirit, a battle is progressing all around you.
16:15 --> 16:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And quote, the army of saints ever grains ground under the divine general ship.
16:20 --> 16:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Now slowly, then rapidly, driving before that what irreversible force, the broken ranks of the enemies in, quote, these are the generals by the way, as pastors.
16:29 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: There was no place for compromise on principle, quote, there is no middle course, no neutrality, each one less enlist, either with the followers of Christ or those of Satan.
16:38 --> 16:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And you can see, if you understand eschatology, like he's seen, this world will be reclaimed for Christ.
16:43 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_01]: This army of God will win the battle.
16:46 --> 16:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It's slowly fast.
16:47 --> 16:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Whatever it is, over time, Satan's saying is already lost the battle.
16:51 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And eventually it's just a divine, you're either a shooting at the end of year or not.
16:56 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_01]: But it will be one.
16:57 --> 16:58 [SPEAKER_01]: The army is happening.
16:59 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Are you following this conquering for Christ?
17:01 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And once again, if I knew a 20 year old who wrote something like that,
17:05 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, good.
17:06 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
17:06 --> 17:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That's that's what I want to see, right?
17:08 --> 17:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm putting another check in the Yes box set.
17:10 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It's art.
17:11 --> 17:19 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're hearing that you're sending your kids off the college and nervous about what they're going to learn and at 20, they send you back Christarmy, you're going to be feeling pretty good about like the direction that young man's headed in.
17:20 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I see using some, you know, this and that maybe I don't agree with everything.
17:23 --> 17:24 [SPEAKER_01]: He says, but I like his heart.
17:24 --> 17:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I like his passion for God.
17:26 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And even just that line, there is no neutral ground.
17:29 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I do kind of agree with that, right?
17:31 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a good point.
17:32 --> 17:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I think even today.
17:32 --> 17:33 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a slowly.
17:33 --> 17:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
17:35 --> 17:36 [SPEAKER_01]: That's him at 20.
17:36 --> 17:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's very fired up for God.
17:38 --> 17:41 [SPEAKER_01]: What is, was so then what happens?
17:41 --> 17:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he gets involved with speaking.
17:42 --> 17:44 [SPEAKER_01]: He goes off to university.
17:44 --> 17:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, his family has always been big on evolution.
17:47 --> 17:50 [SPEAKER_01]: The Presbyterian Church had a big wrestle during this time.
17:50 --> 17:52 [SPEAKER_01]: with do we accept evolution or not?
17:52 --> 17:54 [SPEAKER_01]: The mateian family was in that camp too.
17:55 --> 17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: That's part of the reason they became friends.
17:56 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_01]: They have a Lucienus and as he kind of went off into these different universities and stuff, he became the intellectual, a very smart guy, read a lot of books,
18:11 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So what goes wrong in Wilson's story?
18:13 --> 18:15 [SPEAKER_01]: What word is he kind of mess up?
18:15 --> 18:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, there may have been signs of this already, but as he's getting older, as he goes off to college, he goes to John Hopkins University and eventually gets involved with Princeton.
18:25 --> 18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He becomes the intellectual.
18:27 --> 18:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And the intellectual things that are happening in the late 1800s, evolution is a big part of that.
18:32 --> 18:43 [SPEAKER_01]: We also see alongside evolution, the idea of eugenics, Darwin creating the origin of the species, the subtitle of that is survival of the fittest of the races.
18:43 --> 18:49 [SPEAKER_01]: There's this idea that some races are better than others, and it was very much a part of Darwin's work.
18:49 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It was very much a part of the evolutionary string I thought at the time.
18:53 --> 18:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Woodrow Wilson will become heavily involved in that.
18:56 --> 19:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of this might have already kind of appealed to his family's nature anyway.
19:00 --> 19:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Remember they were on the Confederate side of the South.
19:03 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, many people who were on the Confederate side over time, they switched their beliefs or realized they were wrong on some of those issues, but some of them did not.
19:11 --> 19:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And, or whatever it was, it became intellectually info to look down on people who were of a different race and to see them as lesser than.
19:20 --> 19:35 [SPEAKER_01]: and it may not have been what it would not say that's what every person who has ever subscribed to the idea of evolution believes but it was certainly a part of some of the early beliefs of evolution and it will certainly be part of Woodrow Wilson's beliefs which we will see as he it's going.
19:35 --> 19:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Now eventually he becomes the president of Princeton University.
19:38 --> 19:45 [SPEAKER_01]: He has arrived at his first kind of position of power and when the very first now by the way there are
19:49 --> 19:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't know there was even one.
19:50 --> 19:56 [SPEAKER_01]: There is one of those famous schools there in the American Princeton is kind of like one of the Ivy Leaks, the big boys, right?
19:56 --> 19:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, they say AL and Harvard and Kirk.
19:59 --> 20:05 [SPEAKER_00]: though those ones, I don't know how I missed from you, this was a super, that is a significant diversity, so anything good.
20:05 --> 20:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I know.
20:06 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_01]: But it brings us a big one.
20:08 --> 20:22 [SPEAKER_01]: It originally presented theological seminary a bunch of really famous Christians from J. Gresham, which I mentioned earlier at BB Warfield, like the Hodge family members, like this can be a real hub of really good Christians have come out of that part of the world.
20:22 --> 20:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's a, sorry.
20:25 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Princeton's university is next door to it, like it was created.
20:29 --> 20:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Presbylogical seminary was created with a look like Princeton University kind of went to secular.
20:33 --> 20:42 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're kind of like two different parts, but they're almost the same, like the president of one, becomes the president of the other professors of one, become professors of like they're very much intermingled.
20:42 --> 20:48 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, J.Gresh, a major will be running like we'll be a professor at the seminary, but he'll regularly go hang out with his friend Woodrow who's president of the
20:50 --> 20:55 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not, they're not the same, but they're super in mesh with each other and they back and forth a lot.
20:55 --> 21:01 [SPEAKER_01]: So while he's president of Princeton, University's friends with these guys, and they're great Christians and are writing great stuff.
21:02 --> 21:07 [SPEAKER_01]: A famous Christian Charles Birch and calls them the Princeton were these are fighting for biblical and errands that you're during their time.
21:08 --> 21:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And then, with your lesson, we'll do something, he will segregate Princeton University.
21:14 --> 21:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So, he will say black students and white students are not supposed to be in the same place at that same time.
21:20 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to push, I'm not sure if they were allowed in the same classroom, but they're not allowed to sit together in the same class anymore.
21:26 --> 21:28 [SPEAKER_01]: they're not going to be roommates anymore.
21:28 --> 21:34 [SPEAKER_01]: President University had a long history of allowing people from different races to co-mingle.
21:34 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, it was not a part of the south.
21:36 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_01]: It didn't have any of those problems necessarily.
21:38 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But under Woodrow Wilson, not a longer they are not too.
21:41 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_01]: They are going to start preaching and teaching this idea of eugenics.
21:44 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And the same guy is going to get up.
21:47 --> 21:48 [SPEAKER_01]: and people loved his speeches.
21:48 --> 21:55 [SPEAKER_01]: When he would give speeches, steering chapels and stuff, one of the people I read basically was like nothing was better.
21:55 --> 22:00 [SPEAKER_01]: They want to speak your canceled and and our president Woodrow would have to get up and give a sermon off the cup.
22:01 --> 22:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He would have the entire campus and thrall because he would just be speaking from the heart.
22:05 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And yet, at the same time, this is the same guy who is now said or eating the campus and saying one group of people is the lesser than another group of people and that we're not going to treat them.
22:15 --> 22:18 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the same, and we're going to actually treat them quite a bit worse here.
22:20 --> 22:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, Princeton University, he doesn't, he has some other things start to happen during this time.
22:25 --> 22:27 [SPEAKER_01]: For example, he starts to become very stressed out.
22:27 --> 22:31 [SPEAKER_01]: One day, he will wake up and he won't be able to see out of one of his eyes.
22:32 --> 22:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Today, doctors, I read, yeah, not good.
22:35 --> 22:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Doctors, I read said that they believed he had a stroke.
22:38 --> 22:43 [SPEAKER_01]: At the time, the doctor said he had hardened arteries, but either way, the prescription was pretty much the same.
22:43 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: You're too stressed out.
22:45 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to calm down.
22:48 --> 22:50 [SPEAKER_01]: He's the president of a university.
22:50 --> 22:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I can see how that would be very stressful.
22:51 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to a very tumultuous time to academically universities are being pushed.
22:56 --> 23:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Europe has gone in this very liberal direction, kind of abandoning the Bible and kind of embracing all of these criticisms and things like that.
23:03 --> 23:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Princeton has kind of under that pressure to do the same.
23:06 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And Woodrow's hand is kind of lightly bringing them down that path.
23:10 --> 23:26 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not necessarily doing it very directly, but he is like, let's be smart, let's be intellectual, let's be academic, and the president he kind of chooses to come after him will push aside like conservative speakers and openly embrace more of these kind of anti the Bible is an area kind of people.
23:26 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It'll be a slow step, but they're walking in that direction and Woodrow's a key link in that bridge.
23:31 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: But he stressed out, so his family goes on vacation.
23:34 --> 23:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And while they're on vacation,
23:36 --> 23:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, Woodrow will me a very nice lady, which could be a really nice story except he's already married.
23:44 --> 23:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I was about ask action.
23:45 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_00]: There's he said he's going on holiday with it.
23:47 --> 23:54 [SPEAKER_01]: They definitely, and they made a really nice lady and he really connects with this gal and they become very, very firm pen pals.
23:55 --> 24:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, historians want you to know there's no evidence that he ever cheated on his wife.
24:04 --> 24:19 [SPEAKER_01]: But if I read the letters to you and I asked you I didn't tell you these names they were and I asked you to tell me which letters or to his wife and which letters or to this other person and I don't think audience I don't think mark you would be able to tell they are firmly written and very much the same ways and in fact.
24:20 --> 24:26 [SPEAKER_00]: you might actually start to guess in the wrong direction because sometimes the letters to the other woman are almost more flowery.
24:26 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_01]: He would always call her his beloved, for example.
24:29 --> 24:32 [SPEAKER_01]: He would speak very sweetly of his eternal happiness in her, etc.
24:33 --> 24:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Not the way I hope any.
24:35 --> 24:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope no one's listening and going to watch the problem.
24:37 --> 24:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I do that with all my friends said it leave a comment if you want to talk to you.
24:40 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: We have to eat and get you to a good biblical counselor, so now you guys are thinking you're off of the little bit there.
24:45 --> 24:46 [SPEAKER_01]: This is really bad.
24:46 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_01]: on out his wife knows about this and encourages this, which is very strange.
24:55 --> 24:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It wives don't encourage you has been to write, types like this to other women.
24:59 --> 25:08 [SPEAKER_00]: This is already my third, I have some questions and this is the first one that's actually directly about who broke himself, but this is very strange.
25:08 --> 25:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me put a first of all that he's doing it, very strange,
25:14 --> 25:29 [SPEAKER_00]: That's just a major red flag I think in a relationship when someone has like and and maybe this wasn't a known thing back then but like now I think we'll we also talk about things like emotional cheating like getting more emotionally involved with someone else.
25:32 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure they may not have used the same language we did, but I'm sure they were aware of the concept Yeah, and then and but then the wife also encouraging it really makes me question like was she even like happy in this marriage Like what's going on there?
25:44 --> 25:48 [SPEAKER_00]: She was not happy but the reason she was not happy was because the year before
25:48 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Her brother was also a professor at Princeton, his wife and their newly-born child were in a carriage crossing over a bridge that bridge collapsed the carriage went into the water and the entire family drowned and died.
26:03 --> 26:07 [SPEAKER_01]: and then this news reached her and reached her only other brother.
26:07 --> 26:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And that caused her other brother.
26:09 --> 26:13 [SPEAKER_01]: He was so devastated by the loss of that family, that he had a complete mental collapse.
26:13 --> 26:15 [SPEAKER_01]: That had to be like put it in the silent.
26:16 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So she went into a deep like pit of depression.
26:20 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And she felt like basically I'm horrible.
26:24 --> 26:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm awful.
26:24 --> 26:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm depressed.
26:25 --> 26:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I'm just broken.
26:27 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So she encouraged what you're like basically like, oh, we're happy.
26:30 --> 26:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Go find some happiness.
26:31 --> 26:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad that you're finding happiness right now And I don't think that's healthy.
26:35 --> 26:49 [SPEAKER_01]: No We're not a bit We're not a barital fancelerous, but I think I can say with some confidence the best of Yeah, yeah, like like I don't even have to like open my Bible and say like hey, this is like like
26:50 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you need some help.
26:51 --> 26:53 [SPEAKER_00]: You need me to talk to someone.
26:54 --> 27:02 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're feeling really depressed because your entire family died in a carriage, drowning accident, that's understandable, but don't push your husband emotionally as the arms of another woman.
27:02 --> 27:06 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not going to be the best for your family and the long run.
27:07 --> 27:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I can get that advice and firmly stand by.
27:09 --> 27:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't get on the old advice, you're saying, so then diversions that threw me wrong.
27:14 --> 27:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And so that's kind of what happened with those two.
27:17 --> 27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And they kept this a secret for a long time.
27:19 --> 27:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And it will come out later if it'll come out for a very different reason.
27:22 --> 27:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And it will cause Woodrow some trouble when this eventually comes out.
27:26 --> 27:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Now again, historians, all of the scholars will say, there's no proof of an affair.
27:30 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But at one point, he will be on a night like they go down to this island like Jamaica or somewhere regularly that's kind of like their vacation that they do and at one point he will go to Jamaica and right to his wife oh I ran into her there what a surprise and they spend a month together by themselves on this island because he happened to run into her.
27:51 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that's one of those things like, okay, maybe there is no proof.
27:55 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But geez, you've got to help in your case.
27:59 --> 28:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like scholars and historians, you guys, I don't want to be rude, but you mean a little dense here, like, well, there's no direct proof, you know, there's no black and white photo of them in the room that got okay, but I mean, this is not all, is that what you want?
28:11 --> 28:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, right.
28:12 --> 28:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but they happened to land on the same island as Finn a month together while he was on vacation.
28:18 --> 28:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, let me ask you this.
28:21 --> 28:27 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're significant other, land it on an island and it happened to spend a month with a guy here with the earth a guy or girl they write letters back or forth.
28:27 --> 28:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Would you accept that as set to?
28:31 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Would you go while this?
28:34 --> 28:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, like, this is just a coincidence, well, in the Navy, it was new.
28:38 --> 28:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't think it's going to hold up very well.
28:40 --> 28:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me put it like this.
28:41 --> 28:46 [SPEAKER_00]: If that's you listening to this podcast, I have a great investment opportunity for you.
28:47 --> 28:48 [SPEAKER_01]: you leave it's size.
28:48 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of our five studios crypto coins because you seem like a very sincere person who believes things.
28:56 --> 29:07 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's a big size scandal, a part of a story, but I think is worth mentioning and it's certainly worth mentioning when we're evaluating his Christianity, but it doesn't necessarily have a whole lot to do with his presidency and citizenship.
29:07 --> 29:10 [SPEAKER_01]: You know what you're like, oh, I thought you said president, I said you're talking about president,
29:12 --> 29:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But that you just said he needs to get less stressed because he's having strokes.
29:15 --> 29:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I did say that So he decides that he doesn't like being president of Princeton and he approaches the dinner crap party New Jersey at the time and basically goes like hey, I want to get into politics I'm done me in president of Princeton and And he literally like the quote is basically like I want to get into the politics and I don't want to be anybody's VT if you know what I mean
29:35 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's pretty firmly putting himself out there.
29:38 --> 29:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm presidential material, right?
29:40 --> 29:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm the big dog, put me in there.
29:42 --> 29:48 [SPEAKER_01]: This nobody who's never been elected to any office ever is directly approaching a party say would you run me for president?
29:49 --> 29:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know if he understands what the position of president of the United States is like, but that's not a less stressful job.
29:55 --> 29:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I think than the current one that he will.
29:57 --> 30:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, like 1912 was when he became president.
30:00 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like a, like, a perfectly easy year.
30:03 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_01]: That's he.
30:03 --> 30:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not the president.
30:04 --> 30:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I like, and that is a good time to be president.
30:06 --> 30:09 [SPEAKER_01]: The early 1900s nothing bad happens.
30:09 --> 30:10 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's good.
30:11 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_01]: He, so he, so he, he does end up so he kind of a crazy story.
30:15 --> 30:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But like, the new Jersey Democrats have lost every election for a long time.
30:19 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And they were kind of like, well, he's a professor.
30:22 --> 30:23 [SPEAKER_01]: He has no connection to politics really.
30:24 --> 30:26 [SPEAKER_01]: What if we run him and just kind of see what happens?
30:26 --> 30:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And he'll look like the outside candidate that super clean cut he's got a PhD is a smart guy unless he happens.
30:33 --> 30:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, the cynical people, like say that the Democrat party also had like a very corrupt machinery.
30:38 --> 30:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And they were like, this newbie will be very easy to control, but the public will think he's a nice guy.
30:43 --> 30:45 [SPEAKER_01]: That's exactly what happened.
30:45 --> 30:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Everyone was like, wow, he seems like a really nice guy.
30:47 --> 30:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not corrupt.
30:48 --> 30:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Like all the other politicians.
30:49 --> 30:50 [SPEAKER_01]: He's just a smart professor.
30:50 --> 30:51 [SPEAKER_01]: They elected him.
30:51 --> 30:57 [SPEAKER_01]: They did not find that actually Woodrow Wilson was very easy to control hit very strong ideals of how to run things.
30:57 --> 30:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And the Democrat party actually got cut out of power.
31:00 --> 31:07 [SPEAKER_01]: He passed a bunch of rules like defanging them because he was like, I'm sorry, these other groups, my ideals that I came up with in Princeton that you're kind of out of here, guys.
31:08 --> 31:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And that made him super popular because he stood down this political machinery.
31:12 --> 31:18 [SPEAKER_01]: He truly acted like the outsider, and that got his name into the ring for President of the United States.
31:18 --> 31:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the presidency that is running in 1912 is a fascinating one, because it's one of the few.
31:23 --> 31:28 [SPEAKER_01]: in American history where there was a legitimate third party candidate that actually received votes.
31:29 --> 31:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And not only was there a third party candidate that received votes, there was actually a fourth party candidate that received votes.
31:34 --> 31:46 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, the socialist of America had their best every year with one million votes with Eugene Debs who ran part of his campaign from the prison where he was shoved into for being a socialist.
31:47 --> 31:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And that was their best ever, like they've never done better than that guy.
31:50 --> 32:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, the other person running is theodore Roosevelt, who had already been president, uh, but he decided to run as a third party bull mousse candidate and I believe it bull mousse party candidates.
32:00 --> 32:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe it's the name of it.
32:01 --> 32:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I was going to ask a question there.
32:03 --> 32:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so it's a new party and you may have noticed that and recent elections.
32:06 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't remember any bull mousse party people running in the end of the past because they didn't do super good.
32:18 --> 32:24 [SPEAKER_01]: A Republican, he wasn't very popular, things weren't going super well, and Roosevelt was like, I kind of agree with the Republicans, but I have new ideas.
32:25 --> 32:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I would do something new, so try to fight a new party.
32:27 --> 32:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Those two end up splitting the votes, and so Woodrow will some will win.
32:31 --> 32:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, Woodrow wasn't exactly the guy.
32:33 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, when the Democrats were trying to pick the nominee,
32:36 --> 32:47 [SPEAKER_01]: He was very low on the list, but this very kind of corrupt mob boss guy put all his weight behind this other guy, and everyone didn't want to help him out, so they all ran to other candidates.
32:47 --> 32:48 [SPEAKER_01]: 46 votes later.
32:49 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow won enough votes to become the nominee.
32:53 --> 32:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So they had to vote 46 times, like 46 rallies.
32:57 --> 33:13 [SPEAKER_01]: six year olds of voting to get him to the nominee of dinner crap party and when he wins the presidency he doesn't win with like this overwhelming majority it's pretty clear that it's the door Roosevelt and Eugene doubts had it been there like it's I don't think we would have had a withdrawal while some presidency.
33:13 --> 33:18 [SPEAKER_01]: He barely wins the Democrat nominee nation and he barely wins the presidency.
33:18 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_01]: But don't let that stop you, Woodrow.
33:20 --> 33:25 [SPEAKER_01]: He walks into the White House like he won a clear vendetta like the American people made it clear from God.
33:25 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm supposed to be here in this moment.
33:27 --> 33:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And as he's getting inaugurated, I don't know if it's true or not, but the myth, at least the legend is he kind of turned around his friends.
33:34 --> 33:37 [SPEAKER_01]: He said, wouldn't it be the biggest irony of history if my presidency is remembered
33:40 --> 33:43 [SPEAKER_01]: which is like, I'm not, I'm the guy who's going to fix America from the inside.
33:43 --> 33:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Wouldn't it be funny if I was remembered for things that happened overseas?
33:46 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Good to see that.
33:47 --> 33:49 [SPEAKER_00]: That is some great fortune as I can get in the shadows.
33:50 --> 33:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I got some news for you.
33:52 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_01]: 1914, two years later, World War One kicks off, and Woodrow Wilson's going to be famous for in 1916, running against World War One, saying, we will not commit any voice to Europe.
34:01 --> 34:02 [SPEAKER_01]: You're confined to some more.
34:02 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, you guys are on your own, which we held to until Woodrow Wilson got reelected in about two
34:10 --> 34:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And they, you know, it's speaking for Europe.
34:12 --> 34:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that was good for us.
34:14 --> 34:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, well, they could really help.
34:16 --> 34:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So I would give Woodrow clothes and credit for this.
34:18 --> 34:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say, yeah, you know what?
34:19 --> 34:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad that you guys got some help from the Amelia-American fresh soldiers that came into the allies and kind of cleared things up.
34:26 --> 34:30 [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm not going to give Woodrow clothes and credit because the person he ran against said, hey,
34:30 --> 34:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying we will little work, but I'm saying that if the situation needs us to go to war, I'm open to having that go-to-war and help Europe.
34:37 --> 34:41 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll drill, ran very clearly on under no conditions, we'll be able to go to war in Europe.
34:41 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Four months later, he's announcing time for war in Europe, and I'm like, okay, you don't get to protect, like that is to me, that's pretty scummy.
34:48 --> 34:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he basically knew war in Europe would be unpopular.
34:51 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_01]: So, the other guy says he's open to it, I'll say no, get reelected, and then we'll change things once I'm reelected.
34:55 --> 34:58 [SPEAKER_01]: To me, that is totally a politician move.
34:58 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no way things change that much in those six months and he really did what he had to change it.
35:03 --> 35:07 [SPEAKER_00]: So, let me do like a little bit of like like a temperature check.
35:07 --> 35:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Like okay, so he's had his first four years of presidency.
35:11 --> 35:14 [SPEAKER_00]: You said he was coming in with some new ideals.
35:14 --> 35:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let me get it back to the like where I was.
35:15 --> 35:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm more interested in those.
35:17 --> 35:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it was less an over the four years.
35:19 --> 35:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let me get through some of those policies because so far, again, we've only seen that one segregation on Princeton.
35:24 --> 35:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, now that he has the ultimate power, he unleashes it all.
35:29 --> 35:52 [SPEAKER_01]: for starters in any uh anybody should feel annoyed by this he brought the income tax back which had been um they had been tried out in America during the civil war wants to civil war was paid off they undid it they're like okay no more income tax in 1912 which reals someone's like hey boys with income tax is back um he promised it would be temporary but if you're in America you know that it's it's still a very long temporary and
35:52 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_01]: He also brought in what's called the federal reserve that was placed under him.
35:56 --> 36:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not an economist enough to understand everything the federal reserve does, but I do know that it was supposed to help with the American dollar and the value of the American dollar is like 2% of what it was in 1912.
36:08 --> 36:09 [SPEAKER_01]: that didn't work out very well.
36:10 --> 36:14 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a reason why you're grandpa it by like a house with a nickel and you can't.
36:15 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And that is a lot of that is some.
36:17 --> 36:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's some truth to that, but there's also, I don't know, there's just this, you can know what principle of like inflation, like like money needs to keep.
36:26 --> 36:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I need to keep moving.
36:27 --> 36:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know the Federal Reserve is the where the idea comes from.
36:30 --> 36:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Like before that everything was back by gold and you would have these kind of gold bus cycles where money would go up.
36:35 --> 36:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It was there wasn't gold to catch up.
36:36 --> 36:38 [SPEAKER_01]: It would kind of crash back down.
36:38 --> 36:39 [SPEAKER_01]: It was very normal and cyclical.
36:39 --> 36:45 [SPEAKER_01]: The Federal Reserve and then it will be expanded on my FDR is emerging in the economic survey from not one.
36:46 --> 36:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But the idea is basically, like, we can control that cycle.
36:48 --> 36:58 [SPEAKER_01]: We can keep the cycle from being so bad that your wife be down entire markets all at once, which is a natural way the markets play out, but instead, we'll kind of control the fall.
36:58 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_01]: The fall will, you'll never get as high as you once did, which never get as low anymore.
37:02 --> 37:08 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to kind of try to put our hand to these forces, but these forces are far bigger than what can be controlled.
37:08 --> 37:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And so what ended up happening was run away in Slation to the point that a hundred years later, things have just gotten
37:15 --> 37:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And the people who were writing against the Federal Reserve and where it gets said, like, hey, if we do this, our children's children will have dollars that are worth nothing.
37:25 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And the dollars not worth nothing, but we did just get rid of the penny.
37:29 --> 37:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So, I mean, we are getting to a playing where, like, if we're trying to say the Federal Reserve was a great idea, the people who criticized it, their theories turned out for the most part.
37:38 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, totally, but that that's economic stuff.
37:40 --> 37:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's get to the stuff that really matters to us.
37:42 --> 37:44 [SPEAKER_01]: How about how he handles racist?
37:44 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Did he get better?
37:45 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
37:46 --> 37:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The federal government was immediately segregated, white people, black people, if the idea of the, and there's always his idea, like the four-week racial, everyone working together.
37:54 --> 37:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's something that's really important, like when you look at it,
37:56 --> 37:57 [SPEAKER_01]: American history.
37:57 --> 37:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Many of you have read to Kill a Mockingbird or something like that.
37:59 --> 38:01 [SPEAKER_01]: You know that the South was segregated.
38:01 --> 38:05 [SPEAKER_01]: You know that there was a time when black people went to one water fountain and white people went to another.
38:06 --> 38:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's very easy to have this kind of idea and a solution that assumes the Civil War ended.
38:13 --> 38:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Like the Southern is walked over and took all the water fountains.
38:15 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of how most of us would think of it.
38:17 --> 38:18 [SPEAKER_01]: That is incorrect.
38:19 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_01]: there was actually a period of time where everyone was kind of like they weren't getting a log, but everything was okay, it is.
38:26 --> 38:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you were going through America, there weren't black water foms and white water foms and so it was about a 20-year gap, where everything was just kind of there.
38:34 --> 38:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And not saying everything was racially great.
38:35 --> 38:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure there were problems, especially in different parts where the old Confederacy South.
38:41 --> 38:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they weren't all hungry, or
38:44 --> 38:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Where did this idea of the Jim Crow laws and stuff?
38:46 --> 38:48 [SPEAKER_01]: If I recall correctly, this one's from memory.
38:48 --> 38:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Jim Crow gets passed at 1895.
38:50 --> 38:53 [SPEAKER_01]: That's 30 years after the American Civil War.
38:53 --> 38:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, why did all this stuff start up later?
38:55 --> 38:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It goes back to that evolution eugenics idea.
38:58 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_01]: The idea that some races have evolved and become superior to others, led to the idea that these people should not be interacting sight with these people.
39:07 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_01]: This is not coming from some evil racial prejudice that was rooted in slavery like it's often taught.
39:13 --> 39:17 [SPEAKER_01]: This came from an evil prejudice that was rooted in science.
39:18 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It was rooted in the idea that people evolved and were becoming something that's why, by the way, these eugenicists were extremely
39:26 --> 39:31 [SPEAKER_01]: focused on not letting people have children together that were not of the same race.
39:31 --> 39:42 [SPEAKER_01]: They really believed that you wouldn't let a monkey and a human have a child while they and these numb my words be very clear, but they really saw it as the same.
39:42 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_01]: They were like, if you're a peanut of the African of children, it's basically going backwards in evolution.
39:46 --> 39:48 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not the same species.
39:49 --> 39:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And so how dare you let them interact like they were.
39:52 --> 39:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And as crazy as that sounds, look it up in Google.
39:55 --> 39:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the help of me.
39:56 --> 40:01 [SPEAKER_01]: They took a person from Africa and put him in a zoo in New York.
40:01 --> 40:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Theodore Roosevelt and many famous people went and saw this guy.
40:05 --> 40:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And they treated him like you.
40:06 --> 40:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And they had him actually hold a baby monkey to emphasize the point that this person is an animal.
40:12 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_01]: No, is that your perspective, then segregating, well, your segregating, different species?
40:17 --> 40:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the perspective of Woodrow Wilson, as he segregates the government, as he segregates the Navy.
40:22 --> 40:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the Navy was like, we're all on the boat, how could we be segregated?
40:26 --> 40:30 [SPEAKER_01]: And Woodrow Wilson's a figure it out, because you are not the same species, you're not gonna be together.
40:31 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_01]: There were some black civil rights leaders that came to him, and they basically were like, what you do in, like this is absolute madness.
40:38 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_01]: You're setting us back so far, like, how could you go backwards?
40:42 --> 40:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And he said to them basically, I'm going to try and quote this for memory because I'm not seeing it my notes here, but he's basically said, you know, you gentle and it should be happy with what I'm doing.
40:52 --> 40:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm doing what's best for all of us.
40:56 --> 40:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And there wasn't woman who met him during this time.
40:59 --> 41:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And she said, I met many people from around the world.
41:02 --> 41:07 [SPEAKER_01]: She was like, but I've never met somebody who didn't like a single black person, like which or little, something like this, Abby.
41:08 --> 41:11 [SPEAKER_01]: He has a hatred and an issue there that's so much deep.
41:11 --> 41:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's a lot of resources, but he's like, they're keen to be the source.
41:15 --> 41:22 [SPEAKER_00]: This is crazy to me but also trying to think a little bit bigger than just Woodrow Wilson because of course he's the president but he doesn't have like absolute power.
41:23 --> 41:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Like this is apparently like a bigger movement than happening as well.
41:27 --> 41:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Well so that's something Woodrow Wilson pushes.
41:30 --> 41:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So if you try to name people presence from the late 1800s, I can name some of them.
41:34 --> 41:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we can believe it.
41:35 --> 41:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But most people are like, I don't know it's like Abraham Lincoln Woodrow Wilson.
41:39 --> 41:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's actually like a maybe theater or Roosevelt but there's like a plain space in people's minds.
41:44 --> 41:51 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a reason why it's not just residency bias because I can name Herbert Hoover or FDR.
41:51 --> 41:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And those are recent per se, but you probably know their names.
41:55 --> 41:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Why can you know the names of these guys, but not necessarily people from the 8000s?
41:58 --> 42:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the American founders, the idea was that president's not a king, just because one president wants something he shouldn't be able to completely control the federal government and enforce it.
42:08 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But the same literate Wilson that wasn't ill at the New Jersey Democrat machine tell them what to do.
42:12 --> 42:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Also, it wasn't fixing to let the United States government tell them what to do.
42:16 --> 42:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He started one of the reasons presidents he became so important was because Woodrow Wilson extended his power out to the absolute max that he could and would pull the levers of power.
42:27 --> 42:30 [SPEAKER_01]: in ways that no other president really had done before him.
42:30 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_01]: The reason why, you know, normally people would stand up and say, you can't say, you can't say, you can't say, you can't retire.
42:35 --> 42:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't care.
42:35 --> 42:38 [SPEAKER_01]: He made his rules and basically was like, how are you going to stop me?
42:38 --> 42:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, come after me if you want.
42:40 --> 42:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And it was intellectually invoked to believe what he was believing all the high academics.
42:45 --> 42:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's got a PhD.
42:46 --> 42:47 [SPEAKER_01]: He's from Princeton.
42:47 --> 42:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you yeast the smart guy?
42:48 --> 42:52 [SPEAKER_01]: You guys are the backwater dummies who know that you were caught about the image of God and all that.
42:52 --> 42:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But you're the ones who are behind all the times.
42:55 --> 42:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He's the one who is kind of forward thinking going where they need to go.
42:59 --> 43:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really gross, too, because a lot of these ideas that he's pushing for, I mean, it will even go up to Hitler will say what he's kind of putting together his own programs.
43:07 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_01]: The Germany, he will look at the American South and he'll look what they did.
43:11 --> 43:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It worked.
43:11 --> 43:13 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what we're looking for here.
43:13 --> 43:15 [SPEAKER_01]: They got their people segregated.
43:15 --> 43:17 [SPEAKER_00]: It's never a great sight.
43:17 --> 43:19 [SPEAKER_00]: When Windows people are looking at what you're doing.
43:19 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Everybody, you, that's what I want.
43:20 --> 43:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Why is one of the, like, he was looking at the softness and that's the blueprint.
43:23 --> 43:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, they're keeping them away from each other.
43:25 --> 43:27 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what we want to do, too.
43:27 --> 43:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So, did it go?
43:28 --> 43:31 [SPEAKER_01]: This is what the intellectuals of the world are thinking.
43:31 --> 43:37 [SPEAKER_01]: This is the big, stuffy new universities around the world is that word, and he's friends with the guy his name is like, Cluckin' Wild or something on that.
43:37 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not correct.
43:38 --> 43:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's something really wrong like that.
43:40 --> 43:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And this guy will go over to, you will, you will know, that's not what he's friends.
43:45 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry, he said butcher of carpet cut gun awhile or something like that.
43:48 --> 43:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You can tell I'm not looking at my notes as much for this episode.
43:50 --> 43:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I apologize for that.
43:52 --> 43:54 [SPEAKER_00]: But this guy, he's a British Troy rant.
43:54 --> 44:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this is really me ranty, but he's friends with this guy who's a eugenicist who will go off to round a concentration camp in Germany.
44:01 --> 44:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And like as far as we know, their friends to their final days out, Woodrow Wilson dies in like 1924.
44:06 --> 44:09 [SPEAKER_01]: The concentration camps happen 15 years later.
44:09 --> 44:14 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's kind of the guy that he's running with that he quote, admires and respects those kinds of people.
44:14 --> 44:17 [SPEAKER_01]: The guy in the people who later on run concentration camps.
44:17 --> 44:17 [SPEAKER_01]: That's because of people.
44:18 --> 44:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And we're still not dealt with it on race because he has several more under his administration several race riots happen.
44:22 --> 44:24 [SPEAKER_01]: We're white people like Lynch and killed black people.
44:25 --> 44:26 [SPEAKER_01]: He never sent in the National Guard.
44:26 --> 44:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He did nothing to help out.
44:27 --> 44:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't care.
44:28 --> 44:31 [SPEAKER_01]: He also, the KKK famous group of people.
44:32 --> 44:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, a lot of you will let the KKK rule the South for 100 and something years.
44:35 --> 44:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Not true.
44:36 --> 44:39 [SPEAKER_01]: The KKK showed up right after the Subore, then they went away.
44:40 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they came back.
44:42 --> 44:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, why do they come at?
44:43 --> 44:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Woodrow Wilson helped edit a textbook on the South.
44:46 --> 44:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And in that textbook, he talked about the KKK and how they were these romantic, adventurous nights that protected white people from the scourge of other people.
44:55 --> 44:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm using nicer language that he is because this will be on YouTube and we'll get stuck.
44:59 --> 45:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we will get shut down for using the language he does.
45:02 --> 45:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So know that what I've seen is the more clean version than what he said.
45:05 --> 45:07 [SPEAKER_01]: and he romanticized them.
45:08 --> 45:12 [SPEAKER_01]: They put this textbook out and this group of people turned it into a movie, and they said we pulled some of your quotes, Woodrow.
45:13 --> 45:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Can we, you know, can we show you this movie?
45:15 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he had it screened at the White House.
45:17 --> 45:19 [SPEAKER_01]: The movie is called Birth of a Nation.
45:19 --> 45:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It is an extremely racist movie about how the White South was oppressed and needed to rise up all that stuff.
45:25 --> 45:26 [SPEAKER_01]: It glorified the KKK.
45:27 --> 45:37 [SPEAKER_01]: and the Kukos plan that you're familiar with that you've seen pictures of, that's the KKK that was birth in 1920s based on the support it gained from this movie, the birth of a nation.
45:37 --> 45:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We got a backup a moment ago because you mentioned you said screened at the White House, like he's like having his own year doing my darling to see it, to screen it, to give him their stamp of approval from the White House.
45:49 --> 45:53 [SPEAKER_01]: We like this movie and like even if you don't agree with the movie, if the
45:57 --> 45:59 [SPEAKER_01]: that is not a, at least somewhat mainstream position.
46:00 --> 46:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, it was extremely racist, extremely backward, extremely wrong.
46:04 --> 46:11 [SPEAKER_01]: But it purported this idea that some races are higher, some races are lower, and that's just science at the time in 1915.
46:11 --> 46:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what are you going to do stay in the good science and be wrong?
46:14 --> 46:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Not Woodrow, he's pushing forward with these ideas.
46:18 --> 46:22 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, he's a pioneer of science and new ideas.
46:22 --> 46:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, new ideas that are really backwards and worse than the previous ideas work.
46:26 --> 46:27 [SPEAKER_00]: This.
46:27 --> 46:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
46:28 --> 46:30 [SPEAKER_01]: That alone should make you if you're listening.
46:30 --> 46:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my gosh, you cheat on this wife and he does on that.
46:32 --> 46:33 [SPEAKER_01]: But we're not even.
46:33 --> 46:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Is there still any, like, in this whole eugenics thing, because you did mention, like, man-made in the Eugenics.
46:40 --> 46:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So would they say, like, like, this is evolution and the eugenics is kind of, like, also a, um, I've got to say, right, like a post millennial kind of ideas, well, where it's, like, men kind of is becoming better.
46:55 --> 46:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is the best way to say what I know.
46:57 --> 46:58 [SPEAKER_01]: There's some people
47:01 --> 47:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Like the idea of Jesus coming like that we're winning on earth all that stuff.
47:04 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, he's agreeing to that obviously I don't think post-relations.
47:07 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope that's for those so they are not affirming anything that which are a well So this I wouldn't put that on them anyway that would be very you know that we're gonna take the worst also know what I was not one of my questions Man, I was just saying like was he putting those like he's what I thought he was yeah
47:18 --> 47:39 [SPEAKER_01]: putting these ideas together, he saw as a complete package, like as man, he followed into the great, you know, splendid form that humanity is rising above its earlier animal and as we're kidding, and we're going to eventually reach this utopian state and he very much saw a part of how he sees that is in the World War I, it's called the Covenant of the League of Nations.
47:39 --> 47:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Now by the way, we mentioned a history kind of treats him like he was a beleaguered president, but when when time
47:48 --> 48:08 [SPEAKER_01]: false he isn't armies out as America multiple times I'm going to try a list from memory all the countries he invaded before World War I but they they are not a small number of has of nations he sent soldiers into Mexico 11 different times
48:09 --> 48:18 [SPEAKER_01]: In a levy in a 4-person army, he almost started multiple wars with Mexico because most countries don't like what an army of people show up on your border.
48:18 --> 48:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Generally, you know, not not a great bit of romantic.
48:22 --> 48:27 [SPEAKER_01]: No, he also said soldiers to Haiti because he didn't like who they were electing to be their president.
48:27 --> 48:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So he decided to change the president by encouraging a new one, which is not normally encouraged in any works.
48:35 --> 48:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, he sent them to like, uh, to like, close the recap, like, he sent so many different people.
48:41 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I wish I had the, I wish I had pulled the list of it.
48:43 --> 48:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very long script that I've done with Woodrow Wilson in the past, and it's like literally 15 different countries.
48:48 --> 48:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He said to, uh, the guy was not a piece maker kind of guy.
48:53 --> 48:58 [SPEAKER_01]: So this idea that like, oh, he never wanted to send anybody anywhere, but he had to when the chips were down the savior of
48:59 --> 49:24 [SPEAKER_01]: No, he kept sending people to other countries and eventually he sent some of them to Europe But he was by no means peaceful now if I can give him a little bit of credit Supposedly he did come up with a plan to free the Philippines and get them started on independence That would get them out of America's hand America one the Philippines and the Spanish In the world again Spain didn't really know what to do with the Philippines It supposedly would draw Wilson helped to kind of get the Philippines independent
49:26 --> 49:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And also Puerto Rico, so not everything he did was necessarily like 100% evil with that said though Puerto Rico is still in part of America So I guess it's planned there didn't fully come into conclusion Get to the end of World War One, since the soldiers over there fight he calls it the word in all wars He genuinely believes World War One and they call it World War One back then they call it the great word But he genuinely believes when that war is over there will be no more wars left in humanity
49:51 --> 49:58 [SPEAKER_01]: He believes that the world is giving like like Satan is so in his last battle punch against the world in World War One.
49:58 --> 50:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And if we can win this war, the right sides can win this war, we can end all war.
50:02 --> 50:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And he gives his academics his really smart people together, says, come up with a plan of points that I can stand by that can make the world a better place.
50:10 --> 50:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And they come up with 14 points, one of which is the covenant of the Lee abnesians.
50:16 --> 50:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Notice I said covenant.
50:17 --> 50:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Many people have heard of the United Nations.
50:19 --> 50:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, before the United Nations, there was the Lee Nations, which is famous for basically failing, but it's actually the covenant of the League of Nations.
50:26 --> 50:30 [SPEAKER_01]: That language covenant was very important to Wojuro Wilson.
50:31 --> 50:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted its headquarters to be in Geneva, because John Calvin ran a very Christian city in Geneva.
50:36 --> 50:40 [SPEAKER_01]: That was its headquarters, and he wants that headquarters to flow out for the covenant of Illumations.
50:40 --> 50:51 [SPEAKER_01]: He wanted all the nations to make a covenant before God, allowing all the nations to work together into a state of secular world peace that would eventually lead to like Christ's
50:53 --> 50:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And when World War I is over and he has to America, like Europe loves it.
50:57 --> 51:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he, you know, America helped basically in the war with a million fresh troops into the trenches and Germany couldn't survive that.
51:04 --> 51:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it was a really big deal.
51:06 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_01]: People were very happy.
51:07 --> 51:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And so Woodrow Wilson then becomes the first sitting U.S. president to visit Europe while being president and everyone's excited.
51:14 --> 51:18 [SPEAKER_01]: People in America are kind of annoyed because they're kind of like, like, don't get involved in Europe.
51:18 --> 51:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, be over here.
51:19 --> 51:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, we have a tradition of kind of ignoring Europe.
51:21 --> 51:24 [SPEAKER_00]: you got involved in a war that we didn't even want to be in and so you're over there.
51:26 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_01]: We're like, hey, you're not supposed to be, this is royalty stuff.
51:28 --> 51:30 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not Europeans.
51:30 --> 51:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Get over here and run America.
51:31 --> 51:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's substituting random soldiers in the Mexico every five minutes, right?
51:34 --> 51:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, this is not what we're supposed to be doing over here.
51:38 --> 51:42 [SPEAKER_01]: but he decides to go over there and do that and when he gets there, Europe first loves them.
51:42 --> 51:43 [SPEAKER_01]: They're throwing parades.
51:43 --> 51:50 [SPEAKER_01]: One guy writes a poem talking that making it a very intricate comparison between him and the shepherd of the Lord.
51:50 --> 51:51 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really deep.
51:51 --> 51:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He writes back not what I would write, which is like, hey man, thanks to the poem, but that's kind of heresy.
51:56 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But he writes back like, your poem touched my heart, maybe cry, blah, blah, blah.
52:01 --> 52:02 [SPEAKER_01]: He really loved the idea that he's
52:04 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, what do you get so quickly takes off everybody because he's like, I have 14 points to fix your wars here.
52:10 --> 52:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to fix you.
52:11 --> 52:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And the people in charge are kind of like, oh, like, we actually just want to make Germany pay for World War One and take a bunch of territories and business as usual and which I was kind of like, no, no, no, I had not to fix my Europe.
52:22 --> 52:24 [SPEAKER_01]: You guys are stupid, but my scholars and I came up with a plan.
52:25 --> 52:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It starts with this League of Nations and well, you guys dealt the reason you guys do wars because you're not listening to us.
52:30 --> 52:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm sure,
52:32 --> 52:35 [SPEAKER_01]: that made Europe really happy with America in that moment.
52:35 --> 52:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just thinking because I'm just like looking at this thinking about this like, I mean, this is this is maybe like a really like short and short-sighted few things but like there was so much happening or one like so many borders were like remade countries even didn't exist before existed after like that we're
52:57 --> 52:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he kept in groups.
52:59 --> 53:03 [SPEAKER_00]: It was like Europe was really in a very formative period here.
53:03 --> 53:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And like just looking at like like France and Germany, like that border region that just kept shifting over and over for hundreds of years was again, now they were trying to shift.
53:13 --> 53:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And then this guy just shows up like, hey, Europe, I know he's been fighting, but I have a great idea.
53:18 --> 53:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me just, you know, work this out for you.
53:21 --> 53:23 [SPEAKER_01]: It will just sound you, but you just made the case for mine.
53:23 --> 53:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good name God said, Woodrow Wilson.
53:26 --> 53:30 [SPEAKER_01]: for hundreds of years you guys have been so confused and fighting wars and didn't know what to do praise God.
53:31 --> 53:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was a French crime editor said even Moses only had 10 commandments guy.
53:35 --> 53:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Like they did not like his 14 points at all and every time like they got to a conflict like should this colony go to France or Germany blah blah.
53:44 --> 53:46 [SPEAKER_01]: France and Germany are cutting up the world on the Middle East's hours.
53:46 --> 53:48 [SPEAKER_01]: This is ours for taking all these lands.
53:48 --> 53:51 [SPEAKER_01]: and then they get interrupted by Woodrow being like in a covenant of legal makes.
53:51 --> 54:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's literally a light mount, like he is on one track, him and his scholars came up with the solution of world peace and all the reason Europeans are jumping into the pit is because they're just too stupid to realize that greatness has arrived.
54:02 --> 54:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It's Italy at one point will basically like say like,
54:06 --> 54:11 [SPEAKER_01]: If we don't get this land, we're walking away from this whole thing, and Woodrow Wilson is like, I know what to do.
54:12 --> 54:14 [SPEAKER_01]: So he pulls that tight brighter, he writes a letter to Italy.
54:14 --> 54:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm kind of very sickly summarized.
54:16 --> 54:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not exactly this, but it's basically like Italy.
54:19 --> 54:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You recognize goodness when you see it.
54:21 --> 54:26 [SPEAKER_01]: You realize how brilliant the 14 points and the covenant of the legionations is.
54:26 --> 54:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I speak directly to you, the Italian people, get your leaders on board with our plans because they're going to lead you down the wrong way.
54:35 --> 54:37 [SPEAKER_00]: You're telling us you don't respond well to that.
54:38 --> 54:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, basically, since then, they don't, they state.
54:41 --> 54:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'll get destroyed and like, Italy's relationship with America like immediately starts to sound to go death's house.
54:46 --> 54:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, Woodrow actually said very originally on like, we're not going to make Germany pay for the war.
54:51 --> 54:55 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not going to like treat any victors or losers because that will just sow the seeds of the next war.
54:56 --> 55:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow was correct, making Germany pay for the work did so the season of the X-Hort, but that's because they didn't make it pay.
55:03 --> 55:08 [SPEAKER_01]: You see Germany in Britain said nice ideas America, Woodrow, but we're going to make them pay for the war.
55:08 --> 55:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow is like, well you shouldn't and they said we will not join the covenant of the legionations.
55:11 --> 55:16 [SPEAKER_01]: If you do not make us make Germany pay for the war, in Woodrow it's like less, less like in hasty.
55:16 --> 55:24 [SPEAKER_01]: The covenant of the legionations will bring world peace and Britain and France very quickly realized that's the one piece he won't give up.
55:24 --> 55:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So whatever you were arguing with Lidro, if you just threatened the covenant of the legionations, he would back down on anything.
55:31 --> 55:38 [SPEAKER_00]: So in his defense then here would it be fair to say if everyone was on board?
55:38 --> 55:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Would it have worked?
55:39 --> 55:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you think it would have worked?
55:40 --> 55:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that is they hadn't made Germany pay for one or one if they had been a little bit jitter on Germany because like look in World War II Germany's bad guys I feel pretty confident we can all say that they made the mistakes
55:51 --> 55:57 [SPEAKER_01]: But what were one, like the entangling alliance and stuff were such a mess?
55:57 --> 56:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, Germany lost the war, but I'm sure you could say, well, you know, there were some bad things Germany did sure, but what was Germany necessarily is that a bad guys anymore than Britain and France in those wars that they were all entangled with Austria and Hungary and all these other things.
56:12 --> 56:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that it's nearly as clear cut.
56:14 --> 56:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that.
56:15 --> 56:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But we're two, yes.
56:17 --> 56:28 [SPEAKER_01]: World War I is much more complicated, but when you basically drop all of the weight of the war, the debt of the war, the pain of the war onto this one country, you can't drop it on a street hungry, they dissolved.
56:28 --> 56:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't drop it on Russia, they fell over.
56:31 --> 56:35 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't drop it on the Ottoman Turks, they also call out like the only one left is Germany.
56:35 --> 56:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So you make them pay for it, and then they collapse under that pressure as well.
56:39 --> 56:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Germans grew up very embedded by all of the things happening.
56:42 --> 56:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that that necessarily guarantees a rise of the Nazis, but didn't help, and most people would say, what happened here does lead pretty directly to us?
56:51 --> 56:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because that's what I know, like the trio of friends I, that's like basically,
56:56 --> 57:00 [SPEAKER_00]: really messed up relations or I mean there was a war.
57:00 --> 57:05 [SPEAKER_00]: So relations weren't great but then that treaty really like hammered, which in Germany.
57:05 --> 57:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Dritten in France lost tons of people.
57:07 --> 57:09 [SPEAKER_01]: They lost tons of money.
57:09 --> 57:10 [SPEAKER_01]: They're trying to fix things.
57:10 --> 57:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I can see from their perspective why and the the old way was always make the loser pay.
57:14 --> 57:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I can see from their perspective why they're doing it.
57:16 --> 57:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But Woodrow comes in saying I know this doesn't work and then compromises almost he knows because he wants this other thing.
57:24 --> 57:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, to me, I put more weight on him because I'm like, you, new better.
57:28 --> 57:35 [SPEAKER_01]: The other guys are doing what they've always done to supposedly your smarter than this and yet you compromise because you wanted this stupid legionations.
57:35 --> 57:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And one more thing about the legionations, because they're like, well, hasn't he made enough enemies?
57:38 --> 57:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He makes two more enemies that are important.
57:40 --> 57:41 [SPEAKER_01]: The next enemy he makes is Japan.
57:42 --> 57:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Japan was like, hey, we fought in World War I, Europe.
57:45 --> 57:45 [SPEAKER_01]: We're strong.
57:46 --> 57:46 [SPEAKER_01]: We helped out.
57:47 --> 57:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Can we be treated as equals of the legionations?
57:49 --> 57:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And Woodrow Wilson puts all his pressure on Britain to say no.
57:53 --> 57:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, Japan.
57:54 --> 57:59 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not going to write a clause that says all humans are equal in the League of Nations, Japan.
57:59 --> 58:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Basically, Japan was like, would you tell those equals?
58:01 --> 58:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And Woodrow Wilson basically got the British people to say, no.
58:05 --> 58:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And Japan walked back and basically that news.
58:08 --> 58:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I saw it's on inciting events of Japan.
58:11 --> 58:28 [SPEAKER_01]: That crush the Japanese desire to become a part of the world, the extreme radicals in Japan use that as evidence to say will never be accepted, less build our own empire, forget trying to be a part of Europe and America like we're always going to be seeing this different than them the only way that will respect us is if we're powerful.
58:29 --> 58:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So we see this direct inside of it to Japan becoming an empire.
58:33 --> 58:36 [SPEAKER_01]: We see this direct inside of it to make Italians hate America.
58:37 --> 58:39 [SPEAKER_01]: We see this direct inside of it to make Germany hurt.
58:40 --> 58:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And another war that's actually attached to all this, in the middle of like his presidency, another person visited Woodrow Wilson.
58:47 --> 58:48 [SPEAKER_01]: His name is Ho Chi Minh.
58:49 --> 58:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And he came to President Woodrow Wilson saying, hey, can you help us out with France?
58:54 --> 58:56 [SPEAKER_01]: We're in a big buying right here.
58:56 --> 58:57 [SPEAKER_01]: We want France to cool off.
58:57 --> 58:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's colonizing power.
58:59 --> 59:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if we can't become free, we at least need France to like go easier on us.
59:03 --> 59:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow Wilson completely like push it out said, we don't have time for that.
59:07 --> 59:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Deal with France on your own.
59:08 --> 59:09 [SPEAKER_01]: You're an embarrassment.
59:09 --> 59:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we don't care what happens to you.
59:11 --> 59:26 [SPEAKER_01]: 45 or so years later, America's in the Vietnam War with Ho Chi Minh and those people who's now the leader of the communist party, so like I'm not saying maybe Woodrow Wilson couldn't have stopped the Vietnam War, maybe Woodrow Wilson couldn't have stopped the radical elements of Japan getting stronger.
59:27 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_00]: but he didn't help.
59:28 --> 59:35 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm hearing it because I'm looking at these things like even, like, would Germany have been mad if Woodborough wasn't there?
59:36 --> 59:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, because the Treaty of Versailles was really hard on Germany, so they would have been mad.
59:40 --> 59:49 [SPEAKER_00]: But like he, he comes on the scene as like the savior of the world kind of like, hey, here's the League of Names that world peace for all, you know, it's gonna be great.
59:50 --> 59:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he comes on the scene for all these things, but he delivers a none of them.
59:53 --> 59:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he doesn't really deliver on any of the
59:56 --> 01:00:04 [SPEAKER_01]: problem at the littisills that I deliver, but you can't help but wonder if a much smoother maybe much more Christly operator was working who do a bunch of pants and of course here equals.
01:00:04 --> 01:00:05 [SPEAKER_01]: You made the image of God.
01:00:05 --> 01:00:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Get that rid of the League Nations Japan.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the team.
01:00:08 --> 01:00:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we're going to every not just a huge Japan, but even some of the other nations around you and they probably got not Korea, right?
01:00:12 --> 01:00:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But like okay, like some of they would need a real lot everybody on board Japan had Korea as a calling it at that time, so that's why I said that.
01:00:18 --> 01:00:21 [SPEAKER_01]: But like we're going to bring if they had had that attitude.
01:00:22 --> 01:00:25 [SPEAKER_01]: What would that have done to Japan in the site of the world?
01:00:25 --> 01:00:28 [SPEAKER_01]: What would that have done to Japan as they were like, hey, we are being acknowledged as equals.
01:00:28 --> 01:00:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's keep going down this road.
01:00:30 --> 01:00:34 [SPEAKER_01]: For Germany, if they hadn't had all that death, Woodrow could have stopped Britain and France or at least fought for them.
01:00:35 --> 01:00:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe some of that bitterness would have swept in.
01:00:37 --> 01:00:43 [SPEAKER_01]: If Ho Chi Minh had been talked to and during this time, when France's weak Woodrow Wilson went to France and said, hey, by the way, you're having a problem here.
01:00:44 --> 01:00:45 [SPEAKER_01]: How can we make things better if you're not like?
01:00:46 --> 01:00:51 [SPEAKER_01]: a smoother operator who knows how much she could have helped make the world a better place, but we didn't get the smooth operator.
01:00:52 --> 01:00:57 [SPEAKER_01]: We got Woodrow Wilson at the hammer, shoving this covenant down everyone's throat because he believed it was God's way of saving here.
01:01:00 --> 01:01:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm still thinking about it.
01:01:02 --> 01:01:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, I'm done.
01:01:03 --> 01:01:05 [SPEAKER_00]: No, okay, let me just work this one through.
01:01:06 --> 01:01:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's this, and a little bit of a side.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So like there's this in the Anna Jones career.
01:01:10 --> 01:01:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Like in the movie of Indiana Jones, the plot would have evolved without him being there.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Like like the one with, I think it's the Ark of the Covenant.
01:01:19 --> 01:01:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Nazis would have found it.
01:01:20 --> 01:01:22 [SPEAKER_00]: They would have melt their face up.
01:01:22 --> 01:01:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Like everything would have happened if he wasn't there.
01:01:25 --> 01:01:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, like, with this one, I feel like, with King of the Hand, I don't agree.
01:01:29 --> 01:01:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I've read that in France, we're kind of cool with Japan.
01:01:32 --> 01:01:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It was Woodrow who specifically put his thumb on the scales and keep Japan out.
01:01:36 --> 01:01:38 [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't want to say it directly, but it's like very clear.
01:01:38 --> 01:01:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He'd ask, I read that said, Britain, do it for me.
01:01:41 --> 01:01:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I won't.
01:01:41 --> 01:01:43 [SPEAKER_01]: with Germany, you're right.
01:01:43 --> 01:01:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Indiana Jones out, he wouldn't have set out.
01:01:45 --> 01:01:52 [SPEAKER_01]: But imagine if Indiana Jones wasn't sitting there and not opening the box, but he was yelling, open the box, open the box.
01:01:52 --> 01:01:54 [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I was saying?
01:01:54 --> 01:01:55 [SPEAKER_00]: That's kind of what I chose to.
01:01:55 --> 01:01:56 [SPEAKER_01]: The box is over there.
01:01:57 --> 01:02:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Italy, he's not, he hands them the box so open.
01:02:00 --> 01:02:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And then with Ho Chi Minh, the guy shows up and he goes to Cheetos a box, so there you should go find it.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he ought to be like, he's just a visual observer
01:02:12 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_01]: That's just how we handle the wrap up of World War II.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, during this time, some point, or World War I, thank you.
01:02:18 --> 01:02:19 [SPEAKER_01]: That's just how the scaled up World War II for us.
01:02:21 --> 01:02:22 [SPEAKER_01]: It will not stop us wrapping up World War I.
01:02:22 --> 01:02:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, he goes back to the United States.
01:02:24 --> 01:02:31 [SPEAKER_01]: He comes back with his covenant legionations, the thing that we'll say if humanity in war and allow Christ to eventually come back because he's going to set up a new world utopia.
01:02:32 --> 01:02:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And Congress hates it.
01:02:34 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Congress says we will not pass it.
01:02:36 --> 01:02:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Congress says we didn't send you over there to sign a treaty.
01:02:38 --> 01:02:42 [SPEAKER_01]: George Washington said in the founding documents like, don't not the fine dog.
01:02:42 --> 01:02:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So this founding address he's like, hey, don't get involved in a farewell address.
01:02:46 --> 01:02:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:02:46 --> 01:02:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, so you just don't get involved in the tangling alliances of Europe.
01:02:49 --> 01:02:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And you came back from this war.
01:02:50 --> 01:02:53 [SPEAKER_01]: We didn't really want to go to you promise we wouldn't go to.
01:02:53 --> 01:02:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And you're bringing back a treaty we had to sign that makes us a part of some like worldwide government thing.
01:02:58 --> 01:03:00 [SPEAKER_01]: What are you doing, Woodrow?
01:03:00 --> 01:03:00 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like isn't it
01:03:05 --> 01:03:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Fine, he like stomps out of Congress.
01:03:07 --> 01:03:08 [SPEAKER_01]: He goes, I'll blow to the American people.
01:03:09 --> 01:03:13 [SPEAKER_01]: They'll make you pass it because if you don't pass this really into idea, you will all get unelected.
01:03:13 --> 01:03:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he begins a tour through America where he is speaking and eloquated, it just explaining to the American people how this is the greatest thing ever.
01:03:22 --> 01:03:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And while he's going he has a stroke because remember he supposed to be living a stress free height
01:03:29 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_01]: This is not a stress-free type.
01:03:31 --> 01:03:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He has another stroke or his first stroke depending on which diagnosis was correct.
01:03:36 --> 01:03:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He goes home and he will spend the next year pretty much incapacitated.
01:03:40 --> 01:03:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, he will still be president, but he's not.
01:03:45 --> 01:03:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is some scholars, the Woodrow Wilson Foundation, he was great.
01:03:49 --> 01:03:49 [SPEAKER_01]: He was great.
01:03:49 --> 01:03:51 [SPEAKER_01]: He was just in bed sleeping a lot.
01:03:51 --> 01:03:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Other people will point out that he probably was completely mentally incapacitated for this year.
01:03:57 --> 01:03:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He will sign a lot of documents.
01:04:00 --> 01:04:01 [SPEAKER_01]: That will be brought to him.
01:04:01 --> 01:04:04 [SPEAKER_01]: His wife will put them in his room and then we'll come back with them signed.
01:04:05 --> 01:04:10 [SPEAKER_01]: So you do the math on who's running the show.
01:04:10 --> 01:04:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, is this the wife from before?
01:04:11 --> 01:04:13 [SPEAKER_01]: No, she passed away.
01:04:13 --> 01:04:15 [SPEAKER_01]: The first wife, the depressed wife, she died.
01:04:15 --> 01:04:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So wait, can I stop people if you're going to say, let please tell me that it's the other girl like that.
01:04:21 --> 01:04:22 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not.
01:04:23 --> 01:04:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's a third.
01:04:23 --> 01:04:27 [SPEAKER_01]: There's another girl's after his wife passed away, a couple of years later, he needs some really nice galley, likes her.
01:04:28 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And on basically the eve of their engagement, I can't remember if the news breaks, it is actually, I believe that like basically a newspaper person gets a hold of all of these letters from this other woman and publishes them either a sister or somebody, the end of getting out to the world.
01:04:47 --> 01:04:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And or and or it is privately done.
01:04:49 --> 01:04:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't remember which one of us, but this woman goes to him and he's like, Hey, I have to tell you and she they hash it out all night long.
01:04:56 --> 01:04:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And it actually is kind of a sad story because I read it from her perspective.
01:04:59 --> 01:05:04 [SPEAKER_01]: This other woman, the second wife that comes at she thought the world of Woodrow.
01:05:05 --> 01:05:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And then like afterwards, she's like, Oh, he's just a man.
01:05:09 --> 01:05:11 [SPEAKER_00]: was she wasn't that supportive as she was.
01:05:11 --> 01:05:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I was convinced the scholars in this story and said there's nothing going on here and that this was just an accidental friendly letter and that what's been far.
01:05:19 --> 01:05:26 [SPEAKER_01]: She seemed to believe it was something important and she kind of comes out of this meeting and basically I feel like you read her before.
01:05:26 --> 01:05:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm marrying the most amazing man.
01:05:27 --> 01:05:30 [SPEAKER_01]: He's president, I say, but even more that he's a great guy.
01:05:31 --> 01:05:37 [SPEAKER_01]: After that night, it's like I'm going to marry him because he's so important to the world and my duty will be to help him
01:05:39 --> 01:05:40 [SPEAKER_01]: which is a different kind of marriage.
01:05:41 --> 01:05:44 [SPEAKER_00]: That is true, but then coming back to where we just were.
01:05:44 --> 01:05:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a stroke.
01:05:45 --> 01:05:46 [SPEAKER_01]: She's now the wife and charge.
01:05:47 --> 01:05:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I was she very, this new wife is very clear.
01:05:49 --> 01:05:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You're no longer writing letters to her.
01:05:50 --> 01:05:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so your new, your pen towel that you just happen to be super close friends with are not your pen towel anymore.
01:05:56 --> 01:05:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's done.
01:05:57 --> 01:05:58 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not doing that anymore.
01:05:58 --> 01:05:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, I don't remember it.
01:05:59 --> 01:06:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe somebody died or whatever.
01:06:00 --> 01:06:02 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been a while since I looked at that part of our story.
01:06:02 --> 01:06:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not unclear on the details of a letter being very extravagant and detailed.
01:06:06 --> 01:06:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I am just unclear on the dates there for a second.
01:06:08 --> 01:06:09 [SPEAKER_01]: The new wife cuts her out.
01:06:09 --> 01:06:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But now this new wife who's married him, taking things into a room would grow as supposedly signing them and they are coming back signed.
01:06:19 --> 01:06:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Democrat house leader is like kind of like the Democrat people in charge like Woodrow's great and everybody healthier that guy tells great jokes love them so much.
01:06:27 --> 01:06:30 [SPEAKER_01]: The Republicans are going is he like actually running the show.
01:06:32 --> 01:06:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Any instances may be thinking of something in contemporary events right now, but I assure you that this has never happened before.
01:06:37 --> 01:06:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Since.
01:06:40 --> 01:06:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And so the hype here is easy to be signing a lot of documents and things as this is.
01:06:45 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Try to stay away from any controversy.
01:06:47 --> 01:06:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, a lot of recent, you know, I read hundreds of years or so.
01:06:53 --> 01:06:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, so let's how altos would grow though like true.
01:06:56 --> 01:07:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't believe he was definitely not like in it I don't think he was in a 70 so he was younger than that because actually if you're older You may remember that American president used to be younger like Barack Obama was not super old when he was president He was like late 40s early 50s.
01:07:09 --> 01:07:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I believe
01:07:10 --> 01:07:14 [SPEAKER_01]: George W. Bush, I believe, was at his 50s, made your early 60s when you got out.
01:07:14 --> 01:07:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, you know, I can't wait to be 100, so I can start running for president like that's the way it goes.
01:07:19 --> 01:07:23 [SPEAKER_01]: These days, but there was a time when we tended to run youngerish people.
01:07:23 --> 01:07:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow would have been not as young as all that, but it don't think he was not like in his 80s.
01:07:27 --> 01:07:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it hurt there.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so anyway, back to these guys, they're signing papers and this goes on for about a year and then they try to announce that he's going to run for a third term and that's when the political parties had to come together and have a heart to heart and basically go you can't run Woodrow for a third term and she's just like why not like because he's in his room all day no one seen them.
01:07:50 --> 01:07:51 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, no, these are much back there.
01:07:53 --> 01:07:53 [SPEAKER_01]: no.
01:07:53 --> 01:07:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And he would like, she would like bring him out and he would give like little speeches where he would answer questions to prove that he was still healthy.
01:07:59 --> 01:08:11 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I mean, just just the audacity to do it again, to be like, let's go for a third term.
01:08:11 --> 01:08:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I did that that was bold to say like we're going to try one more term in this guy.
01:08:16 --> 01:08:18 [SPEAKER_00]: He's they're very clearly told like there's no third term.
01:08:18 --> 01:08:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, like this is not the only time this has happened, there was also FDR who's in a wheelchair, but runs for president while pretending to be totally healthy gets elected as like by the way, I'm in a wheelchair like you mean, like Health in America and Mary and prison, so not always very forthcoming.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess so.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:08:36 --> 01:08:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And whatever again, other examples you could think up are on your own.
01:08:39 --> 01:08:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So, Priya, Woodrow's, he doesn't, he made, they send it to somebody else and Woodrow is basically like he's still cognizant enough to say.
01:08:48 --> 01:08:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Whoever takes my place needs to really push for, I'm sure you can guess what, the covenant of the League of Nations.
01:08:53 --> 01:08:57 [SPEAKER_01]: The guy goes, okay, we're running on the covenant of the League of Nations, he gets absolutely slaughtered.
01:08:57 --> 01:08:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's like 60, 40 crushed.
01:08:59 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_01]: he's not going to win, and their die is the covenant of legionations.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So, America never joins, which is ironic because about a 40-plus countries do join the covenant, but everyone kind of agreed even before we drill with back, like if America doesn't join, this isn't going anywhere, and it doesn't go anywhere because America does it join the very covenant of legionations.
01:09:18 --> 01:09:23 [SPEAKER_01]: even I think Woodrow dies around 1924 and even his last official speech short.
01:09:23 --> 01:09:25 [SPEAKER_01]: He's recovered a bit from the stroke, so we can kind of talk.
01:09:26 --> 01:09:32 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's like final diet words are basically like his final speech to public is like once the cover of League of Nations is signed, everything's going to be great.
01:09:32 --> 01:09:35 [SPEAKER_01]: You're gonna love it and everyone's just kind of like okay old man.
01:09:35 --> 01:09:36 [SPEAKER_01]: You didn't get the like we're not doing that.
01:09:36 --> 01:09:37 [SPEAKER_01]: This is not gonna happen.
01:09:39 --> 01:10:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And he dies with the dream of this covenant of the legionations that will make everything better and then Jesus will come It this is his whole thing is like it's all been for this the war was fought We're gonna fix it all and it's because of the covenant legionations if you know much about his from covenant legionations doesn't do very well They don't have an army or any real power Japan invades Manchuria and the covenant legionation says hey that's bad in Japan says okay.
01:10:01 --> 01:10:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm out of legionations and legionations go And then juror is so close
01:10:06 --> 01:10:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, many kind of does the same thing, same thing, Germany leaves, and then Italy invades, Ethiopia and same thing, same thing.
01:10:13 --> 01:10:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't do anything.
01:10:14 --> 01:10:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It like, it never has any power or any clay, but it does become the model of the nations, which you could also argue, is yet another fun, but what trouble, but it's cool, I guess you hear.
01:10:25 --> 01:10:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, let's just put it this way.
01:10:27 --> 01:10:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think has been as effective as people I have wanted it to be.
01:10:31 --> 01:10:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a really gentle way to put the United Nations.
01:10:35 --> 01:10:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And so that's Woodrow Wilson's story.
01:10:39 --> 01:10:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's fast forward to his secretion or not.
01:10:49 --> 01:11:07 [SPEAKER_00]: So my first question then would be, do we know anything more because he starts out very Christian, like he starts out really with strong religious views in his, in his, in his, in anything that he says and his, in his, in his publications, like how much of that is there, for example, in the League of Nations, like in the Covenant.
01:11:07 --> 01:11:17 [SPEAKER_01]: He used, I believe, if I remember the phrase, like, covenant is used six separate times, like through the sounding dog and the documents of the covenant of the legionations, he's firmly in the belief that this is a,
01:11:17 --> 01:11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: like an old testament style covenant other nations before God.
01:11:21 --> 01:11:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, so that as well.
01:11:23 --> 01:11:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And then actually like we already talked about the eugenics part also being part of his post-mil vision of like, you know, we're reaching higher levels of basically like where it's only getting better.
01:11:36 --> 01:11:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Like taking those things into account.
01:11:41 --> 01:11:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It does feel genuine on his part.
01:11:43 --> 01:11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I do feel like he was convinced of what he was in.
01:11:45 --> 01:11:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't feel there's like an evil scheme.
01:11:47 --> 01:11:48 [SPEAKER_01]: So that I wouldn't agree with you.
01:11:48 --> 01:11:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He said, I don't look at which, because Woodrow listen, we'll continue even when he's in the peace conferences in Europe.
01:11:53 --> 01:11:55 [SPEAKER_01]: People like try to go to church when he has a chance.
01:11:56 --> 01:11:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like he's known for continuing his attendance and church.
01:11:59 --> 01:12:01 [SPEAKER_01]: You're continuing home Bible studies.
01:12:01 --> 01:12:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Like everything on him, if you're writing down his stats,
01:12:06 --> 01:12:08 [SPEAKER_01]: he looks like he should be a Christian.
01:12:09 --> 01:12:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think this was some, you know, twist the, the, the, the mustache villainous scheme to look Christian to trick everybody.
01:12:17 --> 01:12:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I think which are Wilson definitely believe in the ideals of he's pushing forward because white, the covenant of legionations, he pushed that forward against his own party against his own hurt to the point that it's dressed and not so bad he had a stroke like he was going against everything to do it.
01:12:31 --> 01:12:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So we definitely thought he was doing something good.
01:12:34 --> 01:12:35 [SPEAKER_00]: It just wasn't.
01:12:35 --> 01:12:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I would argue good at all.
01:12:39 --> 01:12:40 [SPEAKER_00]: That is true, but
01:12:42 --> 01:12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we we already talked about it before, but how much can you really put that on him like there were some bad calls?
01:12:48 --> 01:12:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Well the segregation sucks.
01:12:49 --> 01:12:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that one that was inexcusable like let me just as as as you were talking about Just I read on his wife or sorry about eating intricate letters to his to this good friend.
01:12:58 --> 01:12:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He keeps running into.
01:13:00 --> 01:13:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:13:00 --> 01:13:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Who incidentally?
01:13:01 --> 01:13:01 [SPEAKER_00]: good point.
01:13:02 --> 01:13:07 [SPEAKER_00]: There is some very extrusible stuff like I even as as you were talking I looked up like just on this Wikipedia.
01:13:07 --> 01:13:26 [SPEAKER_00]: There's like this quote here that is actually in the bird of a nation, a birth of a nation where he says, a quote by Woodborough Wilson, the white men were roused by a mere instinct of self preservation until at last there had sprung into existence a great coupe looks clan, a veritable empire of the south to protect the southern country.
01:13:26 --> 01:13:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I feel like anyone endorsing the Ku Klux Klan or endorsing this kind of like levels of racism, like absolutely unheard of and not okay.
01:13:39 --> 01:13:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Is there, and this is just me asking, this is not me trying to make a point.
01:13:43 --> 01:13:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Is there any case to be made for time and context?
01:13:48 --> 01:13:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So let me just jump back a second.
01:13:50 --> 01:13:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess this is we're pulling on our computers real quick to do some research.
01:13:53 --> 01:13:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I said earlier that he set soldiers to different countries.
01:13:56 --> 01:13:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't got a quick list for us here.
01:13:58 --> 01:14:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Nicaragua was another one, Dominican Republic Cuba.
01:14:01 --> 01:14:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Apparently also set soldiers and to Russia, but they were not a part of the world or one, Russia effort.
01:14:07 --> 01:14:11 [SPEAKER_01]: This was actually called polar bear expedition to have a help stop the communist.
01:14:11 --> 01:14:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Actually, that is one.
01:14:12 --> 01:14:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Flotra Wilson is an extreme progressive.
01:14:19 --> 01:14:22 [SPEAKER_01]: In the United States, there are still statues of buildings and things named after Woodrow Wilson.
01:14:22 --> 01:14:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you would think of all the people who statues you would tear down, the dudes who segregated the government and like, like, on the federal level should be the first guy.
01:14:32 --> 01:14:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Why doesn't he get torn down?
01:14:33 --> 01:14:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's because he's the father of modern neighborhoods.
01:14:35 --> 01:14:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, he is the founding Democrat progressive dream.
01:14:40 --> 01:14:48 [SPEAKER_01]: If you tear him down, you kind of tear down everything that he stood for, and that's so much of still what that, you know, kind of vision of progressive America is today.
01:14:49 --> 01:14:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So what he didn't like communist.
01:14:50 --> 01:14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And so like when the communist kind of didn't, the one they benefit that he did was like when the communist kind of reached out to him for help, he was very clear.
01:14:57 --> 01:14:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a progressive.
01:14:58 --> 01:14:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not a communist.
01:14:58 --> 01:15:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Go deal with your own problems.
01:15:00 --> 01:15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't work with you guys.
01:15:01 --> 01:15:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And he also did kind of the same thing in China.
01:15:05 --> 01:15:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It
01:15:08 --> 01:15:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So Liberia, not even better.
01:15:10 --> 01:15:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And this doesn't include, again, the soldiers he set the fight alone were one.
01:15:13 --> 01:15:17 [SPEAKER_01]: So this is not exactly a non-interventionist person.
01:15:18 --> 01:15:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is also not exactly a piece making pacifist president like he's sending soldiers all around the world, constantly hearing this time.
01:15:25 --> 01:15:29 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, I don't know, but I would be willing to bet that's a lot more soldiers than average.
01:15:29 --> 01:15:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So back to what you were saying, is there some argument for context of this time?
01:15:33 --> 01:15:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Was that what you were saying with that?
01:15:35 --> 01:15:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that was the question I had because we've been doing this like for Charlotte May and for yours.
01:15:39 --> 01:15:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Why do I think I would say no?
01:15:40 --> 01:15:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Compare him to William McKinley.
01:15:42 --> 01:15:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's not 15 years, but a few years before him, that 15 he was president about 13 years before.
01:15:47 --> 01:15:57 [SPEAKER_01]: During the back of the Spanish war, he has the country of the Philippines, his hands, and he brings people said this first for show, I still think it was.
01:15:57 --> 01:16:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He brings a bunch of Baptists and other Christians together, he goes, what do I do with the Philippines?
01:16:01 --> 01:16:05 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, we won this colony, we didn't really mean to win this colony.
01:16:06 --> 01:16:08 [SPEAKER_01]: We sit like two boats there in the Spanish Navy.
01:16:08 --> 01:16:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It like completely fell apart in front of us.
01:16:10 --> 01:16:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like this was such an accident.
01:16:11 --> 01:16:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know how we got this.
01:16:13 --> 01:16:13 [SPEAKER_01]: But now we have it.
01:16:14 --> 01:16:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So what do we do with it?
01:16:15 --> 01:16:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, I don't want us to become a colonizer that takes over countries and rules them.
01:16:19 --> 01:16:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And Woodrow Wilson is crying and he kind of said the same thing.
01:16:22 --> 01:16:28 [SPEAKER_01]: But he also said, but also will there ever be a greater chance for like real Christianity to enter the Philippines?
01:16:28 --> 01:16:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if we let the Philippines go and become independent, then don't use this opportunity to send missionaries to the Philippines.
01:16:34 --> 01:16:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Like is that on us for not taking this window when we had it wide open?
01:16:38 --> 01:16:38 [SPEAKER_01]: What do we do?
01:16:39 --> 01:16:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he met with pastors and people to pray and care about what do we do with these souls that are in trouble?
01:16:46 --> 01:17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: There's, well, William McKinley's something you're in the same era, only a little bit before him to technically closer to the Civil War than what you're listening, but look at how he handles people that are a different skin color and that are lower than, you know, lower cat, whatever you say, well, some words and that would about this place, it would have no.
01:17:01 --> 01:17:03 [SPEAKER_01]: This was well as how well-known thing.
01:17:03 --> 01:17:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And it will literally mechanically wish like the services like graphic and repair gouache bars that.
01:17:07 --> 01:17:13 [SPEAKER_01]: But the Secret Service like tackle the guy you does it and will you mechanically famously says, hey, don't go easy on it.
01:17:13 --> 01:17:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Like don't be rough on him.
01:17:14 --> 01:17:15 [SPEAKER_01]: He needs Jesus too.
01:17:16 --> 01:17:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And then he dies singing to him to the Lord.
01:17:17 --> 01:17:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Now compare that 12 years later to how Woodrow will smooth his life.
01:17:20 --> 01:17:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Like this is a guy who's also a Christian, also dealing with these issues of grace.
01:17:25 --> 01:17:27 [SPEAKER_01]: You look at the the swing of time.
01:17:28 --> 01:17:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, Woodrow is a product of the intellectual eugenics movement, but there were a lot of Christians saying, this is bad.
01:17:36 --> 01:17:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's a part of the intellectual movement who blows them off.
01:17:39 --> 01:17:43 [SPEAKER_01]: When that guy was taken to a zoo that I mentioned earlier, there were Baptists outside the zoo.
01:17:44 --> 01:17:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, every, and not just Baptists, I'm sure they're a Presbyterian, but they were outside protesting saying, let this guy go.
01:17:49 --> 01:17:51 [SPEAKER_01]: We will pay for his house.
01:17:51 --> 01:17:54 [SPEAKER_01]: We will take him back to Africa, but let he's a human.
01:17:54 --> 01:17:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And it was the intellectual snobs looking down their nose, going, you're so stupid.
01:17:58 --> 01:18:15 [SPEAKER_01]: You think he's a human, and then eventually they did have to let him go, and they took them, they fed them, they brought them back home, like they, he was a mess, this guy's life was ruined basically by this, and that's, so there's Christians living like that calling out this horrible mess, that is, you critics, and then there's Christians like Woodrow Wilson, who seem to be looking down on those guys.
01:18:16 --> 01:18:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think he gets credit for being a product of his time, in fact, he gets credit for being a multiplier of that product.
01:18:25 --> 01:18:34 [SPEAKER_01]: The government was segregated after him, but the government became the situation for a black person in America got significantly worse under Woodrow Wilson.
01:18:35 --> 01:18:40 [SPEAKER_01]: where the local guy might not have hired you because he did the baby trusty or something like that, he might have been a racist jerk.
01:18:40 --> 01:18:51 [SPEAKER_01]: The government up into that point, the federal government was hiring black people equally with white people until Woodrow Wilson, where he created the first barriers to basically say you can only get this high.
01:18:52 --> 01:18:58 [SPEAKER_01]: He made everyone situation worse and even people in his own day said things like, I don't think he likes anybody together.
01:18:58 --> 01:18:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Like back
01:19:03 --> 01:19:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, so.
01:19:07 --> 01:19:12 [SPEAKER_00]: that brings me to the question because like I don't have to ask.
01:19:12 --> 01:19:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Like you're, I think you're a pretty firm no on this one.
01:19:15 --> 01:19:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm then just struggling with this.
01:19:17 --> 01:19:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like how does that, like I was kind of sad, like like a guy so involved and so she good in pushing his ideals, like and some of them obviously bad.
01:19:29 --> 01:19:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the racism that ones without question, but the league of nations, the covenant of the League of Nations in essence,
01:19:36 --> 01:19:41 [SPEAKER_01]: You could say, it is a world that sounds like a very Christian thing to push.
01:19:42 --> 01:19:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I get, I don't think the coming of the legionations was necessarily a good idea.
01:19:45 --> 01:19:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it would work because I don't think the United Nations is worked very well.
01:19:50 --> 01:19:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think giving every legionation in a second, it doesn't seem to work to bring all the countries together necessarily.
01:19:56 --> 01:20:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe someday it could but they don't like all the same countries don't speak the same language I don't mean English.
01:20:01 --> 01:20:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean like they don't all speak you know if one country wants one thing A one country was another and they're just completely out of different high-sides of culture bringing them together in the same room has not necessarily brought them together in a vision for the world
01:20:14 --> 01:20:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to give them, I don't want to say I don't have to do this.
01:20:16 --> 01:20:25 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to give them something to attain to more than just less talk to each other because they can send diplomats to all the history diplomats have been talking to each other.
01:20:25 --> 01:20:29 [SPEAKER_01]: That does, they need something that they're aspiring towards, and the commonly relations wasn't it.
01:20:29 --> 01:20:35 [SPEAKER_01]: But you could see how as a Christian and theory, that could be a good idea, though, as you could see how any Christian could think that that would work.
01:20:36 --> 01:20:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I think for me, I guess, I am a no on Woodrow.
01:20:39 --> 01:20:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I, and it's really hard, like I know that I'm listing all these horrible things he did because I really do think he was an awful, awful president that deserves to be remembered for a lot of really bad damaging things that a lot of the most racist things in America's famous work.
01:20:54 --> 01:20:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, slave money, the 1850s and six always that was it led him.
01:20:57 --> 01:21:04 [SPEAKER_01]: But a lot of the moments that people are thinking of when they think of the really vast up happened, it really did stem from his presidency.
01:21:04 --> 01:21:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Like his bad ideas flowed for the next 60 years and hurt people for decades, not even including World War II and the Vietnam War stuff as well.
01:21:13 --> 01:21:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But on a personal level, I really did struggle with him because I'm like, this guy, where I greases Bible.
01:21:17 --> 01:21:18 [SPEAKER_01]: It's praise.
01:21:18 --> 01:21:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I now reach this.
01:21:19 --> 01:21:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I see, like, why?
01:21:20 --> 01:21:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what, what I struggle with as well.
01:21:22 --> 01:21:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think I've come to conclusion is if he is saved, boys find the skin of his teeth and the grace of the Lord because there's not fruit to show it.
01:21:32 --> 01:21:38 [SPEAKER_01]: But if he, the reason I think he's not is because, you know, the, the parable starting well or something.
01:21:38 --> 01:21:42 [SPEAKER_01]: He like the, the seed went in, maybe it looked like it was producing fruit.
01:21:42 --> 01:21:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But somewhere along the way, politics and his own personal power began to take the idea that I am exempted from the things that apply to other people.
01:21:54 --> 01:22:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I have a vision and it became, yeah, he wanted to cover the legations, but he wanted it because he had a vision for the world that was more important that was actually happening on the ground.
01:22:03 --> 01:22:08 [SPEAKER_01]: He had a vision for how to make Jesus come back and how to make the world a better place for God.
01:22:08 --> 01:22:11 [SPEAKER_01]: That wasn't related to what God actually wanted.
01:22:11 --> 01:22:13 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why he could look down on people of a different race.
01:22:13 --> 01:22:16 [SPEAKER_01]: That's how he could ignore the atrocities of some of these treaties.
01:22:16 --> 01:22:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But it didn't matter because he was getting his way, like his vision of what to do was more important than God's vision.
01:22:22 --> 01:22:31 [SPEAKER_01]: In some ways, it's almost a little bit Saul of the Bible, that's where I, and he should have all the evidence that God is real, but he's just going forward with his only or doing things
01:22:34 --> 01:22:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, in a lot of ways, he's like the courageous cautionary tell you can tell.
01:22:38 --> 01:22:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Boy, he knew the truth.
01:22:39 --> 01:22:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Boy, he looked good on paper, but he was so wrapped up in his own way of doing a so wrapped up and his intellectual, powerful way of going forward that ended up all completely falling apart.
01:22:53 --> 01:23:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I think, I think you're really, or Dave and Anster to a question I hadn't even asked it because I was like the same thing like, but he goes to church, he reads this Bible, he preaches that those sermons like he's in all ways, at least outworkly, like there is all these signs of a Christian of of a disciple.
01:23:12 --> 01:23:24 [SPEAKER_00]: But then like how could it go so wrong and really like that that ambition that selfish like going your own path I think that's really clear where you see him sort of go off the rail a little bit
01:23:25 --> 01:23:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and there's a little bit hints of it throughout, too.
01:23:26 --> 01:23:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Like his is, I'm gonna run for politics and I'm a president, kind of person.
01:23:31 --> 01:23:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that, that's not a humble thing to say, right?
01:23:33 --> 01:23:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, like his little, I'm gonna have my own little affair off to the side here, maybe it's physical labor, it's not.
01:23:39 --> 01:23:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But I, what you would clearly condemn to someone else, it's okay for him.
01:23:42 --> 01:23:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he's making these little exemptions.
01:23:44 --> 01:23:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's doing these little things that show to you.
01:23:46 --> 01:23:50 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of pride there, but he's masking it as he goes.
01:23:50 --> 01:23:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think he's,
01:23:52 --> 01:23:58 [SPEAKER_01]: putting the mask on like I'm going to trick everybody I just think he somehow he disconnected his faith from his life.
01:24:01 --> 01:24:18 [SPEAKER_00]: That is a sad lesson to learn but a very important lesson to learn about humbleness and pride and I think I mean the Bible is clear about pride and it's not how to good thing and yeah I mean I mean I'm I'm going to have to give you an answer right I'm going to have to say so I
01:24:21 --> 01:24:36 [SPEAKER_00]: If I'm completely honest, I'm not going to go no with you, I'm also not going to say yes, I'm going to go with an I don't know on this one because I still do struggle with with the part like, like, how much can you really put on him and he makes mistakes and we all make mistakes.
01:24:37 --> 01:24:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, his mistakes were maybe a little bit more like influential, but that's also because the positioning has like, like, yeah.
01:24:45 --> 01:24:51 [SPEAKER_00]: There's so much here to discuss, but how much can you put it on him that he is in such an influential position?
01:24:51 --> 01:24:59 [SPEAKER_00]: OK, those who have more, or how do you say those that have more responsibility have more to answer for?
01:24:59 --> 01:25:00 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's that.
01:25:01 --> 01:25:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just processing this one out loud.
01:25:03 --> 01:25:05 [SPEAKER_00]: So sorry for the people listening wanting that final answer.
01:25:09 --> 01:25:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I'd like you send as well, like if you do, you know, you even have and you would probably have some questions if you want to spend some time and that you would be like, well, you know, a phrase is a lot, isn't it?
01:25:21 --> 01:25:23 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, she's just really good for giving it to anybody.
01:25:23 --> 01:25:24 [SPEAKER_00]: something like that.
01:25:24 --> 01:25:48 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm I'm going to lean maybe slash no because of but for me it's it's more even like the the the the the character parts like the pride and the affair like like I'm not with those signs like this is an affair like if if my wife will be doing an or if I would be doing
01:25:52 --> 01:25:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're right, like he did it is at that point if it wasn't a physical affair.
01:25:56 --> 01:25:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I can only imagine it wasn't a physical affair because of his pride.
01:26:00 --> 01:26:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, I would never have a physical affair.
01:26:02 --> 01:26:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll do everything, but you wouldn't be glad.
01:26:04 --> 01:26:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, yeah, if you, you might as well have had the physical affair because you did every single piece of the affair part minus that one physical aspect, it's basically the same.
01:26:12 --> 01:26:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, let's go to the sermon on the mountain by Jesus like anyone who has looked at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery.
01:26:19 --> 01:26:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that one's, I mean, I'm not as confused as the scientist on this one.
01:26:24 --> 01:26:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And when you spend the month on an island in the Caribbean together, you're not just, you know, it's not social distancing.
01:26:31 --> 01:26:32 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, that one.
01:26:32 --> 01:26:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, I'd highly godly Christian man.
01:26:34 --> 01:26:37 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been president of like a Christian university who spent
01:26:38 --> 01:26:40 [SPEAKER_01]: would do everything in his power.
01:26:40 --> 01:26:42 [SPEAKER_01]: What does it say to keep away from the appearance of evil?
01:26:42 --> 01:26:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Woodrow will send it everything in his power to have he at bigger than some people.
01:26:46 --> 01:26:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I just told them what else you can say.
01:26:48 --> 01:26:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:26:49 --> 01:26:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:26:49 --> 01:26:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:26:50 --> 01:26:52 [SPEAKER_00]: So final verdict time for like just for the record.
01:26:53 --> 01:26:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say, no, I'm sorry, I do think he started out with some clearly there was Christian ideas.
01:27:00 --> 01:27:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't know if the route was not strong.
01:27:02 --> 01:27:05 [SPEAKER_01]: If he's like the seed that got carried away by the temptations, worries were right.
01:27:05 --> 01:27:08 [SPEAKER_01]: But I look at Woodrow, and I see a man is driven by pride.
01:27:09 --> 01:27:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Not a man who's driven by love for his neighbor or love of Christ.
01:27:12 --> 01:27:12 [SPEAKER_01]: He does.
01:27:13 --> 01:27:31 [SPEAKER_01]: He does look like a Christian on the outside But I'm seeing just a very strong pride and again if I didn't have to be a fair I might just go he's really confused But the affair part of it really does add another layer around like you can't you can't get every policy wrong and also cheat on your wise and get to claim that you're this great Christian
01:27:31 --> 01:27:33 [SPEAKER_00]: and he wasn't the one to stop it.
01:27:33 --> 01:27:34 [SPEAKER_00]: It was his second wife.
01:27:34 --> 01:27:36 [SPEAKER_00]: He said, like, hey, you got to stop.
01:27:36 --> 01:27:42 [SPEAKER_01]: That's because he said it also showed some repent and like, you know, I'm going to come clean moment and grain of his first wife didn't know.
01:27:42 --> 01:27:43 [SPEAKER_01]: He seemed to know about it.
01:27:43 --> 01:27:44 [SPEAKER_01]: It was encouraging it.
01:27:44 --> 01:27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So that is kind of a weird one there.
01:27:46 --> 01:27:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But still the main of God, you should put us off today.
01:27:49 --> 01:27:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't seem like the Lord convicted about it.
01:27:50 --> 01:27:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It seems like he got found out.
01:27:52 --> 01:27:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:27:53 --> 01:28:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so for me, I'm going to say, let me put it like it's like like if you put it on like a zero to a hundred skill where zero is no and the hundred is yes, I'm I'm going to be on like a 15 like not a definitive know.
01:28:20 --> 01:28:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I do, let me put it like this, maybe I'm too hopeful of person, but there's some bits and pieces here where I'm like, I would hope that maybe in his last moments, undocumented moments, this, I know this is a, this is a, this is like, you know, but I would hope that he knew his Bible well enough.
01:28:38 --> 01:28:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say, I would say that, and understand your pity for him.
01:28:42 --> 01:28:51 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a, yes, maybe they think it's a little, if like, it's, maybe the Lord worked and did the, maybe the strokes eventually clear it, hear his eyes a bit.
01:28:52 --> 01:28:58 [SPEAKER_01]: If he is a Christian and have a, you know, great Lord Jesus can forgive anybody, and I know the only by the forgiveness of our sins and grace, can he be there.
01:28:58 --> 01:29:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, wonderful.
01:29:00 --> 01:29:02 [SPEAKER_01]: If he's not he is pitiful, you know, he reminds me.
01:29:02 --> 01:29:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I just say Saul earlier.
01:29:03 --> 01:29:05 [SPEAKER_01]: You really kind of reminds me of Saul.
01:29:05 --> 01:29:11 [SPEAKER_01]: If you look at Saul's early wife, there's a moment or two, where Saul genuinely looks like a decent guy.
01:29:11 --> 01:29:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he helps fight off the Philistines.
01:29:14 --> 01:29:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he does some things for the Lord.
01:29:16 --> 01:29:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And so that makes his fall so much more tragic.
01:29:20 --> 01:29:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Another guy is kind of gelap, where job is a super confusing character in the story of David.
01:29:24 --> 01:29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And he might be saying, oh, don't I have super straightforward.
01:29:27 --> 01:29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He murders people.
01:29:27 --> 01:29:29 [SPEAKER_01]: They even awesome murders people.
01:29:29 --> 01:29:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So murder people get you out.
01:29:30 --> 01:29:31 [SPEAKER_01]: David's in trouble.
01:29:31 --> 01:29:33 [SPEAKER_01]: But Joe does have these moments where it looks like he's a Christian.
01:29:33 --> 01:29:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he's like, I'm the fight for your side and the Lord will see you wins.
01:29:37 --> 01:29:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And he is, yeah, there's moments where he's like, oh my gosh, Joe, I'd like put the knife away.
01:29:39 --> 01:29:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what is wrong with you?
01:29:41 --> 01:29:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And like, that's kind of how I feel like Woodrow.
01:29:42 --> 01:29:43 [SPEAKER_01]: But in the end,
01:29:44 --> 01:29:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It most people think if Joe I've been saved boys by the skin of this tea, he's probably not, and that's kind of the way I am.
01:29:50 --> 01:29:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm actually the more diversity to Joe, I'd maybe be the butcher, but that's because I've been affected more by Woodrow than I had affected by Joe.
01:29:56 --> 01:29:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm so there's all the way that.
01:29:57 --> 01:29:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's like I was affected like I wake up every day.
01:30:01 --> 01:30:11 [SPEAKER_01]: My dollars don't have enough dang Woodrow, but I mean, like, you know, would I get my taxes, I feel like, but realistically, I'm not that affected by Woodrow, but history-wise.
01:30:11 --> 01:30:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, reset America history, we've been affected a lot more by the actions of that.
01:30:15 --> 01:30:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So I think
01:30:16 --> 01:30:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I do see cases in the Bible, look at all the first and second kings who start well in a thumble on that channel that they were and I kind of that's kind of a woodrow looks like to me It looks like one of those guys who you know, I had a good moment in that he trips and hits his head and does a bunch of mess of things on we out there
01:30:34 --> 01:31:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so there you have it, maybe you're a little bit more of a hopeful person like me or you're just like a realist like Troy over here, but let us know in the comments what you think anything we missed and if you've been following Revive thoughts for a while you may have very Troy talk about we're growing the past as well, so maybe you've already given your comments in the past, but just do it again because we would love to discuss them as well, like we said before this episode and on the podcast as well.
01:31:01 --> 01:31:04 [SPEAKER_00]: We also really just want to learn.
01:31:04 --> 01:31:09 [SPEAKER_00]: We think this is a podcast that is really about the discipleship, like, okay.
01:31:10 --> 01:31:11 [SPEAKER_00]: What does it look like?
01:31:11 --> 01:31:12 [SPEAKER_00]: What should it look like?
01:31:12 --> 01:31:14 [SPEAKER_00]: What can we learn from these people on this one?
01:31:14 --> 01:31:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Definitely something about pride.
01:31:16 --> 01:31:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So if there's stuff we missed, just give us a comment.
01:31:19 --> 01:31:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And we'll talk about it.
01:31:20 --> 01:31:22 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll do comment episodes.
01:31:23 --> 01:31:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And we'll hopefully learn some more.
01:31:25 --> 01:31:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe you'll get me to that zero.
01:31:27 --> 01:31:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Or maybe you get Troy above the negative.
01:31:31 --> 01:31:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So, I'm Mark, I will say this.
01:31:32 --> 01:31:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I think Woodrow Wilson almost makes a candidate for Antichrist or not.
01:31:35 --> 01:31:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, let's see, meant to be an Antichrist figure through history or not because he is the ring.
01:31:43 --> 01:31:44 [SPEAKER_00]: That is another episode.
01:31:44 --> 01:31:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I did, that we have another guest.
01:31:46 --> 01:31:47 [SPEAKER_01]: We hope you enjoy listening.
01:31:47 --> 01:31:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Leave your comments, tell us what you think.
01:31:48 --> 01:31:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Were we right, were we wrong?
01:31:50 --> 01:31:50 [SPEAKER_01]: What did we miss?
01:31:50 --> 01:31:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Is there maybe there's some big piece of very obvious Christianity, you know, as final sermon that he gave where he repents us and so let us know if we missed out on those kind of things.
01:31:58 --> 01:31:59 [SPEAKER_01]: We'd love to hear from you.
01:32:00 --> 01:32:04 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Troy, and my name is Mark, and this was Christian or not.