Was Ernest Shackleton a true Christian or just an explorer who mentioned Providence when the ice closed in?
His story criss-crosses amazing adventure stories with some genuinely heartfelt moments. And there are several clues about his faith interwoven throughout the story.
In this episode of Christian or Not, we look at Shackleton’s family roots with the Quakers, his Church of Ireland upbringing, the drinking and accusations, the prayers he actually wrote down, and whether “Providence” meant Jesus Christ or just luck. Was it a personal God or was it just a moment of divinity?
Search “Christian or Not” on YouTube or your favorite podcast app for episodes on Isaac Newton, John D. Rockefeller, Sir Francis Drake, Charlemagne, Mozart, Woodrow Wilson, and Charles Dickens.
The final full episode for season 1!
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00:00 --> 00:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Christian or not is a production of Revive Studios.
00:06 --> 00:15 [SPEAKER_01]: A few years ago, 2022, a team of explorers were looking for a lost vessel, the endurance.
00:15 --> 00:18 [SPEAKER_01]: And the name of the expedition was endurance 22.
00:18 --> 00:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it was the 22nd endurance trip.
00:20 --> 00:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was in the year 2022.
00:23 --> 00:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And using this great advanced and technology, they were able to find out in the Antarctic Ocean region, a ship that had been lost for a very long time, part of the sea, called the Woodell Sea, this ship that had been sunk for a hundred years.
00:39 --> 00:46 [SPEAKER_01]: At almost 10 feet below sea level, it's around 3 kilometers for people who are not using the foot system.
00:47 --> 00:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It was discovered.
00:47 --> 00:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's in its condition was amazingly clear.
00:50 --> 00:56 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, it was sitting upright and it still could see the name endurance written across it, which is amazing.
00:56 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Just a ship sank all the way down to the bottom of the floor and it was still sitting upright.
01:01 --> 01:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And
01:01 --> 01:04 [SPEAKER_01]: After a hundred years, you could still read the name of it.
01:04 --> 01:05 [SPEAKER_01]: That alone is incredible.
01:05 --> 01:15 [SPEAKER_01]: If I can quote from the article, without any exaggeration, this is the finest wood and shipwreck I have ever seen by far said marine archeologists, men's and bound, who is on the Discovery Expedition is now fulfilled.
01:16 --> 01:23 [SPEAKER_01]: His dream on a 50, and then nearly 50 year career, it is upright, well proud of the C-bed intact, and an abreliant state,
01:24 --> 01:25 [SPEAKER_01]: a preservation he told BBC News.
01:26 --> 01:30 [SPEAKER_01]: They used submersibles, they went down, and they found that the world is shocked, it's a beautiful thing.
01:30 --> 01:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Another quote said, we have successfully completed the world's most difficult shipwreck.
01:34 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Search, battling constantly shifting ice, blizzards, and temperatures dropping down to negative 18 degrees Celsius.
01:40 --> 01:43 [SPEAKER_01]: We have achieved what many said was impossible.
01:44 --> 02:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And as if it could be the story could even be more on the money, they discovered the shipwreck on March 5th of 2022, and the gentleman who capped into the ship, who was there when it sank, who brought it on that final expedition.
02:02 --> 02:14 [SPEAKER_01]: died, and his funeral was March 5th of 1922, exactly the hundred year anniversary of that gentleman, Ernest Shackleton's funeral.
02:14 --> 02:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Ernest Shackleton took that ship down to Antarctica with a single goal.
02:18 --> 02:21 [SPEAKER_01]: be the first man to cross Antarctica.
02:21 --> 02:23 [SPEAKER_01]: It was something that no one had ever accomplished before.
02:24 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And to me, I think it's crazy to think about this.
02:26 --> 02:37 [SPEAKER_01]: When I was doing research on this episode, the very first person, an American sealer, not sailor, but like a person who caught and captured 100 seals, was the first person to step foot on Antarctica in 1821.
02:39 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_01]: America already existed and already had the war of 1812 at that point, but that's not that long ago.
02:45 --> 02:51 [SPEAKER_01]: That one of our continents on this earth, there's only a few of them as somebody put their foot down for the first time.
02:51 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_01]: It had only been cited for the first time the year before by a Russian explorer with a British first and mate.
02:57 --> 02:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is crazy.
02:59 --> 03:06 [SPEAKER_01]: In 1911 in Norwegian, beat Ernest Shackleton and some other people who were competing to be the first people to the South
03:07 --> 03:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, 1911, the first time somebody had gone to the South Pole.
03:10 --> 03:14 [SPEAKER_01]: That's only about 50 or so years before we go to the moon.
03:15 --> 03:18 [SPEAKER_01]: And by, it's crazy.
03:18 --> 03:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, that Norwegian team only beat the British team.
03:21 --> 03:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It all of you in history, combined.
03:25 --> 03:31 [SPEAKER_01]: 1911, the Norwegian team beats the British team to the South Pole by five weeks.
03:32 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_01]: That's crazy.
03:33 --> 03:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Very sadly, by the way, this is not an easy job.
03:35 --> 03:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Part of the reason nobody's been doing this is because it was so very dangerous.
03:39 --> 03:47 [SPEAKER_01]: That British team, which failed to beat the Norwegian team to the South Pole, again, all of British history, but by five weeks, they will not make it off the continent alive.
03:48 --> 03:52 [SPEAKER_01]: They will go to round-a-view points where they were supposed to be collected and find supplies.
03:53 --> 04:05 [SPEAKER_01]: But Robert Falcom Scott, the leader of that expedition, the man who mentored and got earned his shackles in himself into Antarctic exploration, will find that nobody met him at the round-a-view point.
04:05 --> 04:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Nobody dropped off supplies and him and his men will die, returning from the South Pole.
04:10 --> 04:11 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll talk more about him later.
04:12 --> 04:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But with these men having touched the Antarctica and gotten to the South Pole, there was only one more goal that early Shackel could then Shackel was in good think of, that was left.
04:23 --> 04:27 [SPEAKER_01]: who could be the first person to cross from one side of Antarctica to another.
04:27 --> 04:36 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're going to get yourself into the history books and have your name forever be synonymous with exploration and accomplishment, you have to do the one last thing that the world sees is impossible.
04:37 --> 04:43 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to cross Antarctica so we took his ship, the endurance, and aimed to do the impossible.
04:44 --> 04:45 [SPEAKER_01]: By Shackleton was wrong.
04:45 --> 04:48 [SPEAKER_01]: There was one more way to get into the history books.
04:49 --> 04:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And he would do it without ever setting foot.
04:51 --> 04:53 [SPEAKER_01]: on any of the soil of Antarctica.
04:53 --> 05:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Indeed, him and his men will be stuck in snow and ice, and what many of claim is, if not the greatest survival story of all time, it is certainly one of the greatest.
05:04 --> 05:12 [SPEAKER_01]: For two years, they will be abandoned and Antarctic ice and experience some of the worst conditions any humans will ever experience.
05:12 --> 05:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And the most amazing part of it all,
05:15 --> 05:23 [SPEAKER_01]: his him and his crew that he leads down there and back will not lose a single soul throughout the entire expedition.
05:25 --> 05:30 [SPEAKER_01]: But in all of that, what we hear at our show will ask is the question, was he a
05:39 --> 05:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
05:40 --> 05:42 [SPEAKER_00]: What an intro.
05:42 --> 05:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this is all right.
05:44 --> 05:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like you've got me here.
05:46 --> 05:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, and we picked Ernest Shackleton forward to show he was on our initial list of Christiana, just from a super quick Google search.
05:54 --> 06:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And we bounced them around for a little bit, we're like, you know, doing some initial research, like, is there enough here to even talk about, like, you know, there needs to be some hints of Christianity to talk about it.
06:06 --> 06:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm glad there are, because this man's story is amazing.
06:11 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I feel I can relate to a little bit sitting here, you know, in the tropics, in an AC, on a 16 degree Celsius, no minus there,
06:20 --> 06:42 [SPEAKER_01]: be a little bit chilly you know it's uh I can relate yeah and and Troy is not googling how Mike's 16 degrees Celsius is a fair diet and I was like a lot of 16 degrees Celsius and I'm going to push back it is not six degrees Fahrenheit in this country I don't think it's ever six degrees Fahrenheit isn't that freezing shouldn't that be like that was an answer ready to it's like seven it's got to be like 70 outside it's never it never gets cold yeah
06:43 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_00]: No, the AC, I'm talking about the AC.
06:45 --> 06:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the AC number on the air conditioner doesn't actually get that number.
06:49 --> 06:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I did feel cold here.
06:50 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just thought that was 16 degrees of coolness, and then you kept getting lower and the lower number was, but okay, he's glad to have me.
06:56 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, we live over here in underneath just to know we did not really turn on a shackleton.
07:00 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Some days I wish I could, some days I'm like, I just want to know.
07:02 --> 07:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Just give me the wall of ice and throw me on and I just want to be cold for five minutes in this land.
07:07 --> 07:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I don't think I'll ever look to.
07:09 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_00]: We're in for a great story here and on Chris Sharon not so actually my name is Mark, I skipped that part.
07:15 --> 07:21 [SPEAKER_01]: My name is Troy and if we can say as we always do and if you're listening, if you listen to every single episode you go ahead, you do this every time.
07:21 --> 07:32 [SPEAKER_01]: It's because we're hoping that every single episode we have new listeners who may be asking the very first question with a show that is so audacious, so bold, so they may be saying maybe a little arrogant to call themselves Christian or not.
07:32 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you guys really dodging whether these people are Christians?
07:35 --> 07:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Of course not only Jesus can do that, but to the best of our ability, we can judge the fruits of people's lives, we can ask questions and determine whether or not they live down their Christianity well or whether there was even the Christianity
07:48 --> 07:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We know that ours is not the final say.
07:50 --> 07:53 [SPEAKER_01]: We know that God is the final say, but we still think we can learn from these people.
07:54 --> 07:56 [SPEAKER_01]: We run Christian her history podcast here.
07:56 --> 08:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It revives studios, murders and missionaries, telling the amazing stories of martyrs and missionaries, revives thoughts, bringing great servants to the past.
08:03 --> 08:07 [SPEAKER_01]: But the question became, well, what about all these other people who live their lives?
08:07 --> 08:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Who did amazing things throughout history?
08:09 --> 08:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Many of them were Christians and they changed the world, but were they really, or some people weren't Christians?
08:13 --> 08:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It was this big question of, what do we do with all of the in-between people?
08:17 --> 08:23 [SPEAKER_01]: and the show of Christian or Christian or not is trying to answer that question and look at their lives and see did they live it out?
08:23 --> 08:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, because I have a feeling most of you are not pastors listening in an office.
08:28 --> 08:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope some of you are pastors.
08:29 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_01]: We hope everyone from the church is listening.
08:31 --> 08:38 [SPEAKER_01]: But I imagine that many of us are going to be listening there not pastors and how can you live out your faith in your love of Jesus?
08:38 --> 08:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Where you are?
08:39 --> 08:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, sure, you're not our shackelton.
08:41 --> 08:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Probably not living through an Antarctic voyage.
08:43 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But even men like this, I think we can learn some things from their life and gain some value of how our faith should look as we go.
08:50 --> 08:53 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's our job, our goal here with Christian or not.
08:53 --> 08:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And we invite you to be a part of this process of either listening.
08:55 --> 08:58 [SPEAKER_01]: You know the story well and you see us miss parts of it.
08:58 --> 08:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Let us know.
08:59 --> 09:05 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're listening to the story well and to it and you're right, I don't know the story well, but I think you really didn't hit this part the right way.
09:05 --> 09:11 [SPEAKER_01]: We will invite you leave comments, we plan to read those comments and have a deeper discussion with you as the listener.
09:11 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't want it to be Mark and Troy gave an answer and that's it.
09:15 --> 09:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We want it to be Mark and Troy started a conversation and we all came together and talked about it because we're all doing the best we can with this.
09:21 --> 09:28 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know them personally, so we're just taking guesses here, but we want them to be the most educated guesses we can as we start a conversation or some of these men.
09:29 --> 09:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so today, it's Ernest Sheckleton's turn, and he is from the people that got famous from an Arctic exploration.
09:40 --> 09:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel he's the only one that didn't really get, you know, and he didn't actually achieve any of his goals.
09:48 --> 09:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to come up later, like he didn't actually ever have a successful expedition.
09:54 --> 09:58 [SPEAKER_00]: and then in old fairness, it was really hard to have a successful expedition.
09:58 --> 09:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, let's say that.
09:59 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess I didn't actually even put that very simple thing together.
10:02 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_01]: You're kind of totally right.
10:02 --> 10:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he is the world's most famous failure.
10:05 --> 10:09 [SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like he failed every single expedition goal.
10:09 --> 10:11 [SPEAKER_01]: He did accomplish some amazing things.
10:11 --> 10:13 [SPEAKER_01]: That's like he failed.
10:14 --> 10:23 [SPEAKER_01]: If the goal, you know, if it was a soldier's mission and he had to, you know, blow up this building for it to be mission success, he might have done a whole bunch of other stuff, but he never blew up the building.
10:23 --> 10:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, just if you look on a map, you find an artica, which is going to be like somewhere on the bottom, you know, it's it's the edge of our flat world and Okay, I apologize if you don't know much about conspiracy theories market.
10:39 --> 10:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I are not conspiracy theorists, but do we get a kick out of sinning?
10:43 --> 10:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, we'll also reach the useless conspiracy theories to each other for fun.
10:46 --> 10:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we do.
10:46 --> 11:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh
11:11 --> 11:16 [SPEAKER_00]: did, uh, so they all made it to the South Pole, Scott never made it back sadly to be fair.
11:16 --> 11:17 [SPEAKER_01]: He never did.
11:17 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_01]: They got the name on the first guy as far as that.
11:19 --> 11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: This was so true.
11:20 --> 11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
11:20 --> 11:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we did what no one else had done before.
11:23 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_01]: A completely unaware that just if just a month before hand, somebody did exactly that same thing.
11:29 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:30 --> 11:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So, but they have their names on the continent, but Shekleton, as far as I know, doesn't have his name on the continent, and Troy is now going to Google that, well, I make bold statements.
11:41 --> 11:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, no, Shekleton.
11:42 --> 11:43 [SPEAKER_01]: It's got to have his name somewhere out there.
11:43 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think his name is on the continent, no.
11:47 --> 11:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, it's very left like a pocket watch behind.
11:49 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_01]: That's somewhere on there.
11:51 --> 11:52 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, you're, you're okay.
11:52 --> 11:55 [SPEAKER_00]: There are some glaciers, ice shelves, and let's okay.
11:55 --> 11:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Got some shackles.
11:55 --> 12:00 [SPEAKER_00]: He's easy in there, but not like a research station because that's the one to actually.
12:00 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Because that's the money, right?
12:01 --> 12:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's the one.
12:02 --> 12:05 [SPEAKER_01]: If you didn't get a research station named after you, it was like you never even visited the continent.
12:06 --> 12:08 [SPEAKER_01]: It is kind of weird, like Antarctica does get sunny.
12:08 --> 12:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It does have like, I believe, grass grows on some part of it somewhere, adhering the summer.
12:13 --> 12:15 [SPEAKER_01]: If you Google it, Antarctica is such an odd,
12:16 --> 12:18 [SPEAKER_01]: like place compared to the rest of the world.
12:19 --> 12:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Very true.
12:20 --> 12:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I just always get hit around with the the fun fact by my oldest daughter.
12:24 --> 12:24 [SPEAKER_00]: She likes it.
12:24 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, what's the biggest desert in the world?
12:26 --> 12:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And I say dumb as I am.
12:27 --> 12:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I say to Sahara, it says, no, it's endorphin hands.
12:31 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
12:31 --> 12:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's a desert because it has very little rainfall.
12:34 --> 12:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So there is a fun fact.
12:35 --> 12:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's hard to cut lush grass.
12:37 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's during the time.
12:38 --> 12:39 [SPEAKER_01]: There is a time.
12:39 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh wait, you got to switch to camera.
12:40 --> 12:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It's true again.
12:41 --> 12:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, I'm right here.
12:41 --> 12:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because it's the only way we can show it.
12:44 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, and are to get or at least somewhere.
12:46 --> 12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, or something gets grassy.
12:48 --> 12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: So like it is.
12:48 --> 12:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And they, they also crazy.
12:50 --> 12:53 [SPEAKER_01]: They have a time period where they dig up dinosaur bones on an article.
12:53 --> 12:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Because there's a very brief window when you can dig around when it's not completely covered in ice and so.
12:58 --> 12:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the window.
12:59 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_01]: You can go out and find the dinosaur bones from the dinosaurs that used to live on an article.
13:04 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Should lead us to a lot of questions about the world, like why are they dying?
13:07 --> 13:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I have so many questions about those things in general.
13:10 --> 13:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the aliens haven't let us know the answer.
13:12 --> 13:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So we're just kind of to be content, part of the time.
13:15 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_00]: You have already found out today.
13:16 --> 13:19 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to hit you around the head with as many conspiracy theories as we can.
13:19 --> 13:20 [SPEAKER_00]: But we're not.
13:21 --> 13:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about Ernest Sheckleton because we've been saying it's a great guy.
13:25 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_00]: We've been talking about, you know, heroic endeavors.
13:28 --> 13:32 [SPEAKER_00]: But it all started out in 1874.
13:32 --> 13:38 [SPEAKER_00]: He was born in Ireland and there's actually not a lot of known about his youth.
13:39 --> 13:39 [SPEAKER_00]: He grows up.
13:40 --> 13:40 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all we know.
13:41 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_01]: probably had an Irish accent and that's about all I know about them.
13:45 --> 13:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Around seven to where between 14 and 17 and I do love the wide open gap and that was because some versions I read was like about 14 and other versions were like no definitely 16 and others were 17.
13:56 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_01]: At some point, in that time period, he quit formal schooling, and he said, that's not for me, an opportunity came up to be an apprentice on a sea vessel.
14:03 --> 14:15 [SPEAKER_01]: That was kind of passing through, and he jumped in, and eventually made his way to the merchant Marines, and eventually he made himself rising through the ring, stewing well at sailing, getting his, I think, masters of the bigger than whatever sailing, not masters the same way.
14:15 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_01]: We would see it like a masters of the university, but some kind of, he was certified, he was good, and eventually ended up with the crew of Robert Salkin Scott, the guy from earlier.
14:24 --> 14:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think he was the third lieutenant or something like that on his crew and it was a pretty fast rise here.
14:30 --> 14:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, he's getting started around the 18 late 1880s and around 1901.
14:35 --> 14:39 [SPEAKER_01]: He goes down with Robert Falconscott, down to Antarctica.
14:40 --> 14:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And they are making this first expedition attempt to get down to the South, southern and most point and reach the South Pole.
14:48 --> 14:49 [SPEAKER_01]: That was the big one.
14:49 --> 14:50 [SPEAKER_01]: That was the goal.
14:50 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The funny thing is, they're all trying to get to the South Pole.
14:54 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So they can be the one whose fame is reaching the South Pole.
14:56 --> 14:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But until we did this episode, I had never, I had never known.
14:59 --> 15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: the Edmundson guy's name.
15:01 --> 15:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I didn't know the name of the guy who reached this alcohol, I mean, did you, or you?
15:05 --> 15:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I do, but I'm a little weird with history trivia.
15:09 --> 15:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm the kind of guy who just, you know, instead of like scrolling through endless rules when you're sitting on the toilet with your phone, I'm the guy in the guy that actually likes scrolling through Wikipedia.
15:19 --> 15:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So I end up on some weird facts sometimes, but I knew that it was this guy named Amonson.
15:25 --> 15:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Also because you have the Amonson Scott
15:28 --> 15:30 [SPEAKER_00]: had heard about, yeah, I've been dropped that.
15:30 --> 15:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a nerd.
15:31 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You're high as you're a really big fan of an Arctic research.
15:34 --> 15:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I got to say it does fascinating and I already kind of like I it is so inhospitable like it's it's dark half the year and then it's just light the other half of the year like like that concept alone.
15:49 --> 15:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's incredibly cold obviously, but then it's a continent like
15:56 --> 16:02 [SPEAKER_00]: ice on water, but this is an actual continent on the bottom side of our earth.
16:02 --> 16:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's just it absolutely fascinates me.
16:05 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Like yeah, so that's why I like reading about these things.
16:08 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's why I knew about these guys, but uh, I have never been close.
16:12 --> 16:17 [SPEAKER_01]: In article interesting, like it is interesting as a concept, but it feels like talking about Mars.
16:17 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I'm never going to go there.
16:18 --> 16:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm never going to be able to get there.
16:20 --> 16:21 [SPEAKER_01]: It's in like he says inhospitable.
16:21 --> 16:22 [SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing you can do.
16:22 --> 16:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's like it's like I'll be really cool.
16:25 --> 16:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I wish I could see it someday, but I know that like it's not going to happen, let's get on something.
16:30 --> 16:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's listen to it.
16:31 --> 16:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I want to pay for it.
16:31 --> 16:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Antarctic cruise.
16:32 --> 16:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh man.
16:33 --> 16:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll come aboard.
16:34 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll serve you the whole outcarrier luggage, but if you're going that way.
16:37 --> 16:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But outside that, there's just no way to visit it.
16:39 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_01]: So as cool as it is in theory, it just feels like the kind of thing that's like, man, that's cool in theory, but I wish I could, I can't do anything about it.
16:45 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, if somebody's like, actually, there's no lighthouse and for $100, somebody, I'm totally, I'd be all over that lighthouse in the heart.
16:53 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But outside something like that, I can't feel closest to Antarctica anymore than I can, like, the Marianna trenches and the like that.
16:59 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they're cool stuff, but it's just inhospitable makes him unrealistic to visit it.
17:05 --> 17:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so they make an expedition down south in 1901 in their goal to reach the southernmost point.
17:10 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_01]: They do, by the way, they get the southernmost latitude up until that point that anyone in history had ever gotten to.
17:15 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_01]: They become the first people to deeply explore what is called the Ross Ice Shelf named after a guy named Ross who had before discovered this ice shelf.
17:24 --> 17:26 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a huge point two kilometer thick.
17:27 --> 17:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Which I don't know what that is in my feet, but it's a thick ice wall that's floating out there in the part of Antarctica And you can get to kind of go straight up it and then you have this giant shelf of ice up there pretty neat and They get all over it.
17:40 --> 17:51 [SPEAKER_01]: They kind of learn it pretty well and it's a really helpful if you're trying to get to the South Pole If you look at the map of Antarctica the fastest way to the South Pole is to cross this ice shelf and get to the continent that way because it's actually
17:52 --> 17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: a much narrower, like it's narrower on the map of Antarctica that way to the South Pole.
17:56 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: You're going a lot shorter distance, which is why people wanted to do it, but you're crossing the nice shelves.
18:01 --> 18:02 [SPEAKER_01]: See if the figure out how to do that as you go.
18:03 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_01]: On this trip, Shackleton got sick.
18:06 --> 18:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And he was sent home early by Scott Scott's like, hey, you're a great sailor.
18:10 --> 18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's short of breath all the time.
18:12 --> 18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: He's weak.
18:12 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_01]: His nerves are tingling.
18:13 --> 18:14 [SPEAKER_01]: He's always tired.
18:15 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, you've got to go.
18:17 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_01]: A scientist believed he had a condition called Barry Barry.
18:20 --> 18:23 [SPEAKER_01]: So it looks like burry, burry, burry, burry, burry.
18:23 --> 18:25 [SPEAKER_01]: At least that's when I read Dr. said today.
18:25 --> 18:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, yeah, we think he is as if the deficiency or something, it probably led to his heart swelling in him dying and a much younger age, he'll die around the age of 47.
18:35 --> 18:38 [SPEAKER_01]: That's hard condition because his body is worn out by this condition.
18:38 --> 18:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's short of breath all the time.
18:39 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He's very weak.
18:41 --> 18:42 [SPEAKER_01]: He sleeps a lot.
18:42 --> 18:44 [SPEAKER_01]: like he's worn out pretty easily.
18:44 --> 18:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's exactly the guy who should be crossing Antarctica on a record that's doing what even fully healthy people would very quickly die trying to do.
18:52 --> 19:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like there's probably some pretty high, how you say, high standards for people that now volunteer or work like, you know, I want to go to this and article, do whatever no research work again.
19:05 --> 19:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably this would have discounted in for absolutely sure.
19:09 --> 19:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It looks like it seems to be there's two types.
19:11 --> 19:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I just Google it, try Barry Barry and what Barry Barry and one, in fact, is a cardiovascular leading to a rapid, well, it may be they go together.
19:19 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's actually cerebral version of it too.
19:21 --> 19:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But anyways, it's a fear of vitamin B1 deficiency.
19:23 --> 19:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Gamages and nervous system causes extreme weakness.
19:26 --> 19:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Heart failure is often linked to diets of polished rice or alcoholism.
19:32 --> 19:54 [SPEAKER_01]: which to be fair we'll get to it but um they might have been a concert um anyway so that's what he's got going on so again not the guy that you would necessarily want to be but if you you know if you have that and hopefully you're not getting it from an alcoholic source or something and your dream is to leave your mark on Antarctica you've got one guy who did it before you probably this guy.
19:54 --> 19:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So he gets crushed by this by the way, of course he does.
19:57 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to be you want to be a part of the team that got to the South Pole.
19:59 --> 20:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Now Scott didn't get to the South Pole.
20:01 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He did this is some great things but then reached the South Pole.
20:05 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, Shackleton goes home, thinking they might have been the guy who did it, right?
20:10 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he doesn't know that until they back.
20:12 --> 20:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he's frustrated and this kind of leads to him becoming his own independent explorer and gets his own mission and gets his own funding.
20:19 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And this takes years and I can only
20:22 --> 20:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, rich person and wealthy patron, the wealthy patron, me like, yes, I'm an explorer, yes, I'm a person wouldn't you like me a part of the team that gets to the South Pole?
20:31 --> 20:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, how are you going to keep from dying down there?
20:32 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I've been there myself.
20:34 --> 20:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And here's how it works.
20:35 --> 20:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And here's what we're going to do different than the other teams.
20:37 --> 20:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And you've got to go quick because there's a German team getting ready to go.
20:40 --> 20:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's a Norwegian team that's already heading down there.
20:42 --> 20:45 [SPEAKER_01]: You want to have your name on, it's almost like race cars, right?
20:45 --> 20:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You want to have their main sponsoring.
20:46 --> 20:52 [SPEAKER_01]: He's got to be a Lord Braffinsberry project, otherwise, you know, you want German people to have, I mean, that's kind of what he's doing though.
20:52 --> 21:00 [SPEAKER_01]: He's making that case, like if it's not us British people, someone else is going to get down there and make that claim to fame and you want to be the guy who sponsored the winner of that race.
21:00 --> 21:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, and something that we're also not haven't talked about yet, but there is a very specific time.
21:04 --> 21:13 [SPEAKER_00]: You can go to the South Pole, which is when it's summer and the summer hemisphere, so winter and the north, summer and the south, because otherwise it's going to be super duper dark.
21:13 --> 21:18 [SPEAKER_01]: We technically, with the southern hemisphere, by the way, in some of your listening, you're an Australian, you're going to say the white big deal.
21:18 --> 21:21 [SPEAKER_01]: But the thing is a lot of our listeners were the door that had his fear.
21:21 --> 21:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So they might not realize that this is technically summer.
21:24 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so just a quick anecdote about it.
21:27 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I met Australian men once at a conference and we're talking, and we were at the conference in the West September.
21:33 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And it was actually my wedding anniversary was going to be in that week.
21:36 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: But
21:37 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, already talked about it with my wife.
21:39 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, this conference is coming and it should be good to go there.
21:42 --> 21:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So I got her blessing.
21:43 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_00]: So I was away on my anniversary and he also had his anniversary.
21:46 --> 21:49 [SPEAKER_00]: So, and he said to me, oh, so you had a spring wedding.
21:51 --> 21:52 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just looked at them like, wait, what?
21:53 --> 21:53 [SPEAKER_00]: No, of course not.
21:53 --> 21:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a full wedding, like, what do you mean?
21:56 --> 21:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It's spring wedding.
21:57 --> 21:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And then I think, oh wait, these from Australia.
21:59 --> 22:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, it's all flipped around.
22:01 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So South Pole, great to be, or great, it's still gonna be super cold, but great to be there in the summer time, not in the winter time, because there will not be any sunshine and it will be,
22:13 --> 22:14 [SPEAKER_00]: even colder than normal.
22:14 --> 22:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So like there's a really specific window that you can go there.
22:17 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So Shackleton has to get the funding in.
22:21 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_00]: He has to get, you know, got his people together.
22:25 --> 22:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Because Britain, which isn't necessarily close.
22:28 --> 22:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And that is why you're starting this expedition out.
22:31 --> 22:36 [SPEAKER_01]: You think it might be based in Australia, but I'm just guessing they didn't have the funds and resources in Sydney.
22:36 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So you got to go all the way down from Britain, get all the way down to South America and
22:42 --> 22:48 [SPEAKER_01]: the southernmost tips of South America into Antarctica and do it all before you run out of time.
22:49 --> 22:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and he does well.
22:51 --> 22:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So they call it the Nimrod expedition, which is strike one.
22:55 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Nimrod is not the guy.
22:56 --> 22:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not the name you want to give yourself your expedition.
23:00 --> 23:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like, right?
23:00 --> 23:05 [SPEAKER_00]: He's he doesn't need to guide a built a tower of Babylon like that kind of time or founded Babylon.
23:05 --> 23:07 [SPEAKER_01]: He's considered many people consider him in the film.
23:09 --> 23:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Nimrod, I mean, it's kind of an insulting name.
23:11 --> 23:13 [SPEAKER_01]: If you talk suddenly in Nimrod, you're calling them dumb.
23:13 --> 23:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you fear, though, in the Bible, Nimrod is not considered dumb?
23:17 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Isn't he like the greatest hunter that I've ever lived for, I think?
23:19 --> 23:21 [SPEAKER_01]: No, but it says a great hunter to the Lord.
23:22 --> 23:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And people argue deeply over whether that means he hunted people, whether he was in the film or whatever.
23:28 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: There's like a Jewish mythology that added this idea that he was in the film and a great hunter to the Lord, but he hunted humans.
23:35 --> 23:37 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a very intensely debated topic.
23:39 --> 23:40 [SPEAKER_01]: actually don't take that opinion.
23:40 --> 23:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this might be controversial, and I hope this isn't.
23:43 --> 23:49 [SPEAKER_01]: But I've always thought Nimrod is a guy who found these different towns, like Babylon, like on Shoeberg and the one in Persia.
23:49 --> 23:51 [SPEAKER_01]: But he found these different places across the Middle East.
23:52 --> 23:58 [SPEAKER_01]: What if he was just a really great hunter who found that these towns was genuinely doing it for God, and then they became corrupt after he died.
23:58 --> 24:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we see throughout a lot of scripture, a good guy does something good, and then you know, it gets corrupted by humanity over time.
24:05 --> 24:07 [SPEAKER_01]: In that case, Nimrod was actually kind of a good guy.
24:07 --> 24:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So we don't really know.
24:08 --> 24:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't like it.
24:09 --> 24:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I was using that definition though.
24:11 --> 24:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure he was using the film one for sure.
24:14 --> 24:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know, but at least, it is a moderate success.
24:17 --> 24:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we already spoiled it right off the bat that he never is actually going to succeed at any of the things that he does.
24:23 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But they do come really close to the South Pole.
24:28 --> 24:33 [SPEAKER_00]: In the same time, Scott is also taking an expedition down south, aimed to reach the South Pole as well.
24:33 --> 24:36 [SPEAKER_00]: They come really close within 97 miles or like 150 miles.
24:36 --> 24:37 [SPEAKER_00]: It was in 97 miles.
24:40 --> 24:40 [SPEAKER_01]: of it.
24:40 --> 24:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, so that's the shackle.
24:42 --> 24:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm mistreating here.
24:43 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:44 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:44 --> 24:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He's with the 97 miles of it.
24:46 --> 24:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the closest anyone got no to that point.
24:49 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And I believe I read that they actually reached the magnetic South Pole at that time.
24:55 --> 25:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So the South Pole is the very bottom of the earth, but the magnetic part kind of that moves around.
25:00 --> 25:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they were able to reach that part.
25:02 --> 25:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's the first person to reach the magnetic South Pole.
25:04 --> 25:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I believe.
25:05 --> 25:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't must be really cool with that's probably where you like your, uh, I held your, your compass is just going crazy.
25:10 --> 25:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Why do we at least meet you a completely different question?
25:13 --> 25:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they knew how to do this.
25:14 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But how did you determine you were at the south pole?
25:17 --> 25:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Like what stars were you aligning with?
25:20 --> 25:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if it's snowing, I'm sure it looks all like snow.
25:23 --> 25:25 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't have satellite imagery as they're trudging.
25:25 --> 25:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, Troy, it's easy.
25:27 --> 25:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So you're walking and you're walking upside down and at one point, you start walking upward again.
25:31 --> 25:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:32 --> 25:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And then you know, you're, yeah, that's,
25:33 --> 25:37 [SPEAKER_01]: that you don't need to pull that Google mouse to just can GPS located that to the right spot.
25:37 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, that's, I mean, that's completely different question.
25:39 --> 25:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't look it up for you guys.
25:40 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I do apologize.
25:41 --> 25:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But I wondered that the whole time, it's like, how did you know you were with the night in seven miles?
25:44 --> 25:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, after a while, you're walking on snow.
25:47 --> 25:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the whole trip is on snow.
25:48 --> 25:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It probably all looks the same.
25:50 --> 25:51 [SPEAKER_01]: No one's ever been there before.
25:51 --> 25:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So it was like a sign at the end.
25:52 --> 25:54 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like South Pole sign, you're right.
25:55 --> 25:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So how did you know?
25:56 --> 25:58 [SPEAKER_01]: What was the sign that you had gotten there?
25:58 --> 25:59 [SPEAKER_00]: that is a great.
26:00 --> 26:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I know that they had to have known.
26:02 --> 26:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I know that they had cartography skills and they had that ability back.
26:05 --> 26:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm curious what their indicator was because I don't have that ability if you draw me in the middle of America and said find the South Pole, I would die, but also I would still not be able to find it.
26:14 --> 26:14 [SPEAKER_01]: So
26:15 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_01]: They also claimed the mountain mount arabas on this trip I believe it was and it would be clear as I was writing this it was really hard to keep some of the trips in tracks.
26:23 --> 26:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was this trip when he caught my arabas.
26:25 --> 26:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It might have been and this is my apologies.
26:27 --> 26:32 [SPEAKER_01]: As I'm just speaking here, it might have been the other trip, but one of those two is the first to climb this mountain.
26:32 --> 26:40 [SPEAKER_01]: on an article and it seemed like, and I'm putting these stories you know, I apologize to the research about 100% on this, but it seemed like as they claimed, they went off to climb the mountain.
26:41 --> 26:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And when they came back or something happened, where the boat that they were supposed to take left.
26:48 --> 26:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they got to the rendezvous point, maybe because they went off on the other trip or whatever, and the boat that's supposed to take them left two days before.
26:55 --> 27:08 [SPEAKER_01]: They were stranded, and if you're stranded on Antarctica, nobody's coming to save you for at least another year if they even land in the same spot, which they might not, they might land somewhere else, and so you're completely hopeless.
27:08 --> 27:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, and they don't know when the boat left, so they take like their camp supplies and they set them on fire.
27:15 --> 27:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Hoping that, hey, you know, this is your everything you have to survive if they aren't coming back if they're wrong on in your dead You know what you're actually dead anyway, so you might as well try they said everything you have on fire and they wait for two Three days or so before the boat returns and they had just they were like yeah, we just thought two days out But it's so much ice sludge to cross out of there that it takes days of breaking up the ice to move the boat That they did see your smoke they saw your signal they came back.
27:41 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_01]: They picked them up.
27:42 --> 27:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't even imagine
27:44 --> 27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: The dress would be like, I sure hope they saw that.
27:46 --> 27:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's snowy stuff.
27:47 --> 27:51 [SPEAKER_01]: For all you know, they were in the harbor, but they just couldn't, oh, the dress would be.
27:52 --> 27:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like a one-time deal.
27:53 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it either works or doesn't.
27:55 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And then you've set everything that you have on fire.
27:58 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah.
27:59 --> 28:03 [SPEAKER_01]: it's suicidal, but also you have to recognize that staying is suicidal.
28:03 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_01]: This is the best chance you have at getting help.
28:08 --> 28:17 [SPEAKER_01]: So I put myself in Shackleton's shoes sitting there with the guys he's with with the fire of everything you have on fire to say they're going, I wonder if this will work.
28:18 --> 28:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I, you know, and then you look at his journey, the rest of his journey.
28:21 --> 28:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And I
28:26 --> 28:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I think sitting there and going, oh my goodness, what if the captain of these people, whoever's running this, doesn't come back and get us?
28:32 --> 28:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I do think this might have actually been from the Scott Expedition, but I guess I got these two crossed a little bit.
28:38 --> 28:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think that changed the way he led his expeditions.
28:41 --> 28:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I think it was kind of like, I never going to put people in that situation where they feel like they're basically dead as somebody doesn't save them, because when he makes the big expedition that we're going to look at, the one that really matters,
28:54 --> 29:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He is dedicated to his men on the level that I think somebody who thought for two days, I'm dead might be dedicated.
29:01 --> 29:05 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, it's like, I went through this and I'm gonna make sure you never do.
29:05 --> 29:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and there's one more thing that we didn't mention yet, but that I also read about this specific expedition, so the name run expedition.
29:14 --> 29:19 [SPEAKER_00]: They got within 97 miles of the South Pole, which I just looked up real quick.
29:19 --> 29:30 [SPEAKER_00]: They could figure out by celestial navigation and by a thing called death reckoning, which is just walking in a straight line, because at one point you sort of know like, okay, you can navigate this is it, and you just gotta keep going the way.
29:31 --> 29:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Which again seems really hard to me when it's everything's white, everything's cold, and you're freezing, and you can probably only see like through like a tiny sliver in, you don't want to freeze your eyeballs.
29:42 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, but they know they got within 97 miles, and then they turned around, because it just got too dangerous, and Shackleton was not going to risk his men, so he's like, okay guys, you know.
29:55 --> 30:10 [SPEAKER_00]: We got this far, but I don't think it's wise to keep going, so we're going to go back well, both still gone and all this stuff that we just mentioned happened, but you see definitely like this this this is a leader like this is a man who is not just a
30:11 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just like a mindless like I got to get my goal.
30:15 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I got to go for this this South Pole before M anyone else does Like he he's a leader.
30:21 --> 30:22 [SPEAKER_00]: He cares for his people.
30:22 --> 30:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So Yes, I like her emanation of a guy is going to get up to the South Pole or across Antarctica Like a kind of determination takes to be crazy enough to try that while at the same time Also having the heart to take care of his people
30:36 --> 30:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's a casualness, just a willingness to risk lives in these adventures and to be just stupid about them, that I don't think we relate to.
30:44 --> 30:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if we hear somebody's in trouble today, we're going to send the rescue teams and do everything we can to you know, the person falls in the volcano and they're going to do everything they can to bring that person out.
30:54 --> 30:57 [SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't seem to be how the Antarctic explorers handled things at all.
30:58 --> 31:03 [SPEAKER_01]: The Robert Falcon Scott expedition that we mentioned earlier, where they did get to the South Pole, but they didn't make it back.
31:04 --> 31:05 [SPEAKER_01]: They got to one of their rendezvous points.
31:06 --> 31:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Three days early, they waited and they waited and they realized, nobody's coming with supplies, nobody dropped anything off.
31:13 --> 31:14 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not coming.
31:14 --> 31:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Why didn't they come?
31:15 --> 31:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, there was a team people that were told that this time go down there and pick us up.
31:19 --> 31:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, get us what we need.
31:20 --> 31:20 [SPEAKER_01]: We need to get out of there.
31:22 --> 31:24 [SPEAKER_01]: They were going to send this group of people.
31:24 --> 31:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the best guy for the job got pulled over by another guy.
31:27 --> 31:29 [SPEAKER_00]: He's like, no, no, no, I'm doing a scientific exploration over here.
31:29 --> 31:30 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to do some science work.
31:31 --> 31:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't let you have that guy.
31:32 --> 31:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, another guy was supposed to do it, but he was like, I don't, you know, I don't really want to have some other stuff going on as well.
31:37 --> 31:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So they sent the third guy.
31:38 --> 31:41 [SPEAKER_01]: The worst guy at Navigating gets lost very easily.
31:42 --> 31:43 [SPEAKER_01]: He goes a little bit of ways.
31:43 --> 31:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't even make it very far.
31:44 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's lost.
31:45 --> 31:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Comes back and goes, I tried.
31:47 --> 31:48 [SPEAKER_01]: That's, what can you do?
31:49 --> 32:02 [SPEAKER_01]: That's, and that's what happened to Robert Falcom Scott, him and his men died in Antarctica, abandoned basically because, and they didn't come back and explore the mice for like another year and they had to go in and they had to go get the bodies and stuff because of some point you do.
32:02 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And the reason all because that they just didn't seem to prioritize getting them back, I mean, that's to me wild, but that's how you're treating these guys.
32:11 --> 32:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And I guess, you know, I guess there's a little bit of like, hey, it's the, I don't say the wild west down there,
32:18 --> 32:28 [SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, all you had to do was meet these guys at the supply and rendezvous point that they agreed to meet on and nobody cared because well, somebody else was doing this and somebody else was doing, you know, it's so casual.
32:28 --> 32:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, oh, did you take out the trash, I thought you were going to do it.
32:31 --> 32:38 [SPEAKER_01]: We missed the trash that except it was people's lives at that is really the vibe it's going so comparatively shackled in.
32:39 --> 32:41 [SPEAKER_01]: is looking very different than these guys.
32:41 --> 32:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's going to be a very standout person compared to that kind of reckless casualness that the other guys are showing.
32:49 --> 32:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, I shackles and gets back to England.
32:54 --> 32:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He's actually raising money to go to the South Pole when they find out that the Norwegian team beat them.
32:59 --> 33:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I hear this, the
33:01 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_01]: sad story of what happened to Scott and he's you know he's so he has to change it up I can't I'm not going to South Paul anymore.
33:08 --> 33:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm crossing Antarctica now.
33:10 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm doing the last thing anybody can do to get their name on the map and he goes to the UK government for help but he was not met with much love like that you could say oh the government might fund this and get their names on the map.
33:20 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm
33:21 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_01]: the private nobody really cared and the prime minister said to him quote I have never been able to care one far thing about the polls so it's not going to be a government fund to trip down to Antarctica with that kind of attitude you know and you know what he didn't cross an article so look at that you can maybe feud but that money and that could have been kind of in yours i i i think the UK has enough things their famous for that that wasn't probably yeah a big priority but you know i mean i will say this
33:48 --> 33:49 [SPEAKER_01]: America stepped on it first.
33:50 --> 33:54 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, a little more ambition, bring that kind of by maybe yours.
33:55 --> 33:57 [SPEAKER_01]: You guys only owned like half the world at that time.
33:57 --> 33:59 [SPEAKER_01]: So, a little more ambition.
33:59 --> 34:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Who knows what you could have had.
34:01 --> 34:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And he so he didn't eventually get the funds.
34:03 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's like, it's like a whole thing.
34:05 --> 34:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a support raising thing.
34:06 --> 34:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, not only did he have to be good at Arctic exploration.
34:08 --> 34:10 [SPEAKER_01]: He'd be good at selling it.
34:10 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he was, it took him years, but eventually he gets another money together.
34:14 --> 34:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I need to ask you like lectures like there was a whole thing where you would go around and you put this the age of pictures actually so this is really cool.
34:21 --> 34:31 [SPEAKER_00]: There's like a lot of pictures from from these expeditions and they look about as heroic and as cold as you imagine them to be they're all in black and white and when the everything snow it is
34:33 --> 34:34 [SPEAKER_00]: a little hard to tell what's going on.
34:34 --> 34:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you can see the boats and stuff.
34:35 --> 34:38 [SPEAKER_00]: The boat of the, you can look up the HMS or is it HMS?
34:38 --> 34:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's, you look up the endurance is boat picture.
34:41 --> 34:42 [SPEAKER_01]: It looks really cool.
34:43 --> 34:45 [SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, it is, it's amazing that we had cameras.
34:45 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I could even take pictures and those kind of frozen conditions.
34:48 --> 34:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And they were actually bringing them actually.
34:49 --> 34:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just not figuring it out because these were not like your small, like, you know, little phone handheld cameras.
34:54 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_00]: These were like machines.
34:55 --> 34:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, these are big and actually when they, like they ate some of these pictures are taken at the camp,
34:59 --> 35:00 [SPEAKER_00]: where the endurance was.
35:00 --> 35:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And I believe they had to take the cameras with them.
35:02 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're like losing supplies.
35:03 --> 35:07 [SPEAKER_01]: They're only able to take some of the things that they'd seem to have taken some of these cameras in the equipment with them.
35:08 --> 35:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, if you're getting funding for it, you know, people will want to see some proof.
35:13 --> 35:15 [SPEAKER_00]: When they put some money in, they want to see the proof that you actually made it.
35:16 --> 35:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So it makes sense.
35:18 --> 35:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Kind of reminds me, and this is definitely not who you should be compared to, and maybe this isn't even a good reference to make, but if you ever seen the Peter Jackson King Kong, it was made like 20 years ago.
35:26 --> 35:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, I think I've seen it.
35:27 --> 35:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I'm even a great, I don't know why, but it was like the whole film, the guys like filming King Kong and everything can try to make that money back so we can be famous.
35:35 --> 35:36 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not at all who earned a shackle 10 is.
35:37 --> 35:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But kind of the idea there, like you're going to go down and do this.
35:39 --> 35:40 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to take some pictures.
35:40 --> 35:42 [SPEAKER_01]: You'll present some scientific papers.
35:42 --> 35:44 [SPEAKER_01]: You'll be a lot of some institutions.
35:44 --> 35:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great thing.
35:45 --> 35:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You just go in and do it.
35:47 --> 35:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, he gets the funds, and not a ton of money, and he has to get people on board.
35:51 --> 35:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He gets 5 people who apply to this job.
35:56 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Supposedly, there's a very romantic ad that he puts out.
36:00 --> 36:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't really like love romance.
36:01 --> 36:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, like speaks to the heart ad, the kind of romance that makes you climb a mountain.
36:07 --> 36:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And the ad, it says supposedly this.
36:10 --> 36:22 [SPEAKER_01]: been wanted for Hazardis journey, low wages, bitter cold, long hours of complete darkness, safe return, doubtful, honor and recognition in event of success.
36:24 --> 36:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I signed me up and give me on that really yes I'm in I you know I hear a lot of tartness and bitter cold and not okay that's not a silly safe return God full that that's where he had me I'm like I don't want that safe return to be sure I want it to be doubtful yeah I'm just a comment about you know the idea of adventuring and going places where no one's ever gone
36:46 --> 36:48 [SPEAKER_00]: The part for me is the cold.
36:48 --> 36:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not a big snowy ice, the shelf kind of person.
36:51 --> 36:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Look, I'm worried about not that kind of shelf.
36:53 --> 36:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Book shelf so nice.
36:54 --> 36:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Not ice shelves.
36:56 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, so that part loses me a bit, but the idea of like exploit, look, I mean, look at like the people who come out here to Southeast Asia, the ones that were crossing these islands for the first time.
37:06 --> 37:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And like exploring and discovering and all this stuff that was out here, I mean, on some level,
37:11 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_01]: it would be so cool and on some level isn't it kind of sad that we live in some ways for the first time in human history where there's nothing to explore really like we've yeah you can go under the sea with the submersible and and find the endurance um but you're underwater that's just not the same and you can go up into space that's obviously super cool but it's so expensive but back in that day if you could just get enough money together in a boat you could start sailing and making an impact that generations of people would be affected by and we just there's nothing like that
37:41 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that is true, and that's where the last line comes in, honor and recognition in event of success, you know, so you could be, you know, gone or you could be immortalized in history and you could be like the part of the team that made it across Antarctica, they never actually find this like research is never found the end and it may be apocryphal.
38:04 --> 38:06 [SPEAKER_01]: that they say that they're pretty sure it's apocryphal.
38:07 --> 38:08 [SPEAKER_00]: No, that's how you say it's sorry.
38:08 --> 38:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Not an English speaker.
38:09 --> 38:11 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
38:11 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's a line here from Troy in the script.
38:14 --> 38:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I choose to believe.
38:16 --> 38:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I choose to believe as well.
38:18 --> 38:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's a great story.
38:19 --> 38:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Luther when he was told to recant in the diet of worms.
38:22 --> 38:23 [SPEAKER_00]: He says, you know, the famous lion's
38:24 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Here I stand, I can do no other.
38:25 --> 38:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And they say, look, there's no historical proof that happened.
38:28 --> 38:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And I go, but I want it to have happened that way.
38:32 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the best version of the story.
38:34 --> 38:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I have to say, it probably didn't happen.
38:38 --> 38:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But I can't, I believe in that version of the story.
38:41 --> 38:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, hey, did I want that to be the best version?
38:43 --> 38:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that's not the way to do history.
38:44 --> 38:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I'm telling you it didn't happen.
38:47 --> 38:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But wouldn't it have been cool?
38:48 --> 38:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, it's a hard thing about history in general.
38:50 --> 38:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, like,
38:52 --> 39:04 [SPEAKER_01]: How come we possibly know we will never really know so a lot especially got a little fun The ancient stories too like we'll have quotes by like out in the general after when in the war You this 3 word speech at when exactly like this.
39:05 --> 39:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know But it sure would be cool if he did it exactly that way You know, there's a little bit where with all history and even with all of all knowledge We're always kind of going what wouldn't it be cool if it was the best version of it was this yeah
39:19 --> 39:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Money was always.
39:20 --> 39:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to believe.
39:21 --> 39:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we want to believe.
39:22 --> 39:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I want to believe.
39:23 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Hi, money was 25 applicants.
39:25 --> 39:27 [SPEAKER_01]: He whittles it down to 56 people, two crews.
39:27 --> 39:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And the idea is pretty simple.
39:29 --> 39:32 [SPEAKER_01]: One crew will reach Antarctica and start crossing it.
39:32 --> 39:43 [SPEAKER_01]: The other crew will go around to the other side of Antarctica across the Ross side shell and begin living supply lines across because they did there's no way to carry enough food and supplies for you to go from one side to the other.
39:43 --> 39:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So you're going to need that other team to have laid out supplies for you so that you would survive to get to the other side to get to the other boat a great plan.
39:52 --> 40:01 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, these two crews one crews going to be down here and we focus on the the one that shackle tends with the endurance, but this other crew has a crazy story to they get blown way off track.
40:01 --> 40:23 [SPEAKER_01]: they go through these crazy bad storms, they do end up leaving all the supply lines out so they did their job but they do lose three men in the process and so it's not a great time for them and then afterwards I believe they sail off to either New Zealand or Australia so they start in Britain, come around Antarctica and then go down to Australia and New Zealand where they kind of get to safety and stuff which is a very long voyage to
40:24 --> 40:27 [SPEAKER_01]: again, you lose three men in the process, but they did their job.
40:27 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Everything they did was correct.
40:29 --> 40:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The problem was, on Shackleton's own.
40:32 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So, Shackleton's crew comes to Antarctica.
40:34 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Can only be approached during summer a couple months of the year where it's actually available to sail.
40:39 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And even during summer, there's so much ice.
40:41 --> 40:43 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so difficult to cut through all that water.
40:44 --> 40:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And you gotta remember, they're not working with
40:46 --> 40:53 [SPEAKER_01]: fast speed boats full of radar, phones, and satellite and everything that we have to get through the water, these giant metal hole can chips.
40:54 --> 41:07 [SPEAKER_01]: He did buy some nice boats, like some of the best Norwegian boats at the time, but they're still wouldn't, you know, they're still working with sales and those kinds of things are not quite at the level of, you know, power and stuff that we would like our boats to have.
41:08 --> 41:26 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's still very difficult process to do what they're doing and then when they arrive they have to start kind of sledging their way through the ice for their breaking up the ice getting on the ice and breaking up the ice which is a course very dangerous while they push through the waters trying to reach the Antarctic shoreline.
41:26 --> 41:33 [SPEAKER_01]: They will sail all the way down and get to within one day's sailing.
41:33 --> 41:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I read, some people said just a couple days or just very close, about a one day away.
41:38 --> 41:39 [SPEAKER_01]: They had had one more day of good sailing.
41:40 --> 41:51 [SPEAKER_01]: They could have arrived and reached Antarctica, but they ended up getting caught in some ice and the boat ends up getting trapped in basically an ice flow FLOE is what is called, but basically the way it looked to me.
41:52 --> 41:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like an iceberg kind of thing where it gets caught in the ice and the ice froze into the boat and held on to the boat.
42:00 --> 42:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is the end of the journey in terms of getting to Antarctica.
42:04 --> 42:05 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't know it.
42:06 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Like they're under the impression like this happens.
42:08 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_01]: We can get through it.
42:08 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, only three years before a German expedition had that the same thing happened.
42:12 --> 42:18 [SPEAKER_01]: They waited for six months and six months later the boat, the ice melted the boat sailed on everything was fine.
42:18 --> 42:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So after a couple days of Shackleton realizing, no, we are really kind of stuck in this ice.
42:22 --> 42:23 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not moving.
42:23 --> 42:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's make camp when it melts, we'll make our break for across and all the supplies and things will be fine.
42:29 --> 42:32 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll just go for it once we're on the other side of this melt.
42:33 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_01]: but the note doesn't happen.
42:35 --> 42:38 [SPEAKER_01]: After they end up trapped in this begins a new phase.
42:38 --> 42:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But again, at first they don't know.
42:40 --> 42:41 [SPEAKER_01]: They think everything's fine.
42:41 --> 42:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Everything seems okay.
42:42 --> 42:45 [SPEAKER_01]: They set up some dog kennels there on the iceberg.
42:46 --> 42:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm quite iceberg.
42:47 --> 42:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not, but the iceberg.
42:49 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_01]: For the ice plateau, the floating ice, whatever it is, they're setting up dog canals, they set up some places for the men to live.
42:56 --> 42:57 [SPEAKER_01]: They're going to make camp for the winter.
42:57 --> 42:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It'll be it'll be fine.
42:59 --> 43:02 [SPEAKER_01]: They even get a wireless radio going, which I'm really impressed by.
43:02 --> 43:03 [SPEAKER_01]: But they.
43:05 --> 43:06 [SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing to hear.
43:06 --> 43:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's no radio signals out there.
43:08 --> 43:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Your local pop radio station doesn't reach out to Antarctica yet.
43:12 --> 43:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So they got a radio going to sell to nothing.
43:13 --> 43:15 [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, it's important to know we know what year it was.
43:15 --> 43:23 [SPEAKER_01]: It was 1914 because as he was leaving, as he was heading out of the UK, a very important event was happening called World War I.
43:23 --> 43:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And this,
43:24 --> 43:37 [SPEAKER_01]: really overshadows the Shockelton adventure like up until that point every adventure down to Antarctica was like really big news and honestly Shockelton, sorry, he got kind of overshadowed by, you know, the great war at that time.
43:37 --> 43:49 [SPEAKER_01]: So a little bit of a bummer for him too, because again at the whole point of the skier they in fame and he won't be remembered as much for this because of World War I, like he's still very famous, but it would have been even bigger deal, you know,
43:55 --> 43:56 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you do?
43:56 --> 44:00 [SPEAKER_01]: He's mistakenly thinking this will be a short trip and they'll be able to get through it.
44:00 --> 44:03 [SPEAKER_01]: But after a few months, things begin to change.
44:03 --> 44:08 [SPEAKER_01]: They start to hear a sound and it is the sound of the ice.
44:09 --> 44:10 [SPEAKER_01]: crushing the boat.
44:11 --> 44:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And they will hear this sound for months of like just err like the boat getting slowly the whole of the crushed.
44:21 --> 44:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And there will come a point when they start to realize the endurance isn't going to fail.
44:27 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Like this is the end of our boat.
44:30 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm looking at a map actually in the meantime.
44:33 --> 44:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And they have drifted like kilometers, like hundreds of kilometers off track at this point, just being pushed around by the eyes basically pushed that way.
44:44 --> 44:45 [SPEAKER_00]: They're just being pushed.
44:45 --> 44:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I have no idea which way this is because it's probably like eastward.
44:49 --> 44:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if this map is oriented north, but they're being pushed away.
44:53 --> 44:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I mean,
44:55 --> 45:20 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not getting where they want to be and just realizing as well like this other crew they've been putting out the supplies like months earlier like like their this expedition is is now I think very quickly turning into a survival mission and yeah so I mean they got a man ship at this point like like this is this is over like this this is not going to the boat is not going to bring them to Antarctica.
45:20 --> 45:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, they know that.
45:21 --> 45:22 [SPEAKER_01]: They will come to them, but there's another right away.
45:22 --> 45:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So when they first get started, and I found this quote from a cook that really, I think, gives you chocolate as personality, like, so when he's in a tough situation, like say your boats getting snapped by the ice, what do you do?
45:33 --> 45:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And here's what the one of the cooks said about him.
45:35 --> 45:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Shackleton did not show rage at all.
45:37 --> 45:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't show the outward sign of disappointment ever.
45:42 --> 45:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's me is really interesting.
45:43 --> 45:48 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, especially when I think of leaders today, when I think of people who say like, what's a good sign of a leader?
45:48 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, this is the classic CEO or Paul, it's always about authenticity and being real, right?
45:54 --> 45:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you got to share where you're really at.
45:56 --> 46:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Little Shackleton, keep me in his guy's alive on a nice perk, was not very authentic.
46:00 --> 46:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He was not very transparent.
46:01 --> 46:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He would not show any signs of disappointment.
46:04 --> 46:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think about it, I'm like, honestly, that's probably exactly what you would want in a situation like that.
46:09 --> 46:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Not a guy who's like, guys, I'm feeling really bummed about hope instead of that.
46:12 --> 46:14 [SPEAKER_01]: You want a guy who's like, totally fine.
46:14 --> 46:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I, that boat crashed good.
46:15 --> 46:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I was actually, you know, I was kind of done with it.
46:17 --> 46:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, you want that guy because this isn't real situation where you can't afford it.
46:22 --> 46:26 [SPEAKER_01]: But in private, in his own writings, we see that he wasn't feeling so confident.
46:28 --> 46:46 [SPEAKER_01]: he was talking to one of his like closest guys there and uh it was like one of them was saying basically the ship can't live in the skipper it may be a few months it may only be a question of weeks or days but what the ice gets the ice keeps so he didn't know they were in trouble but he wouldn't show it to the men he would only carefully show it when it was right to do so
46:46 --> 46:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And I do wonder if that's a leadership quality.
46:49 --> 46:51 [SPEAKER_01]: We've kind of lost the ability of discerning.
46:51 --> 46:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, when is it time to keep the face that everyone needs to see for the group?
46:55 --> 46:59 [SPEAKER_01]: They might know deep down that you're scared too, but they need to see that you're confident sometimes.
47:00 --> 47:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I just this is an interesting question of leadership there.
47:02 --> 47:06 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, if you're climbing Mount Everest, do you want the guy leading the crew just suddenly have a free count?
47:06 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I'm feeling rough today.
47:07 --> 47:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Or do you want to keep smiling going?
47:09 --> 47:10 [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about we're doing advice.
47:10 --> 47:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Even though he might be on the inside screen, but like you need of the smile to get through it.
47:14 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_00]: As the interesting thought, I'm just still processing this quote that you just like really glanced over.
47:19 --> 47:19 [SPEAKER_00]: What a great quote.
47:19 --> 47:22 [SPEAKER_00]: This is what the ice gets the ice keeps.
47:22 --> 47:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
47:23 --> 47:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I said that's wow.
47:24 --> 47:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like a great line.
47:25 --> 47:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Like an, and I know there's not the right place for like a fantasy numbers.
47:28 --> 47:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
47:29 --> 47:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I like the ice lord says as he captures them like what the ice gets the ice keeps.
47:33 --> 47:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, right?
47:34 --> 47:37 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a free line for you playing Dungeons and Dragons or something.
47:37 --> 47:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, slide that in there.
47:38 --> 47:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I know someone that's going to use there.
47:40 --> 47:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you can find
47:43 --> 47:49 [SPEAKER_01]: there was one moment though he did get angry and I really liked this moment so we didn't actually talk about this but this is a great one
47:51 --> 47:53 [SPEAKER_01]: there's a still way on his boat.
47:53 --> 47:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So he actually only picked 28 27 28 people to go with them.
47:57 --> 48:02 [SPEAKER_01]: But somebody snuck on board, which I think is absolutely fascinating.
48:02 --> 48:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So the way, let me just kind of read this to you.
48:05 --> 48:12 [SPEAKER_01]: By this day's just ship was too far in his voyage to turn back, Shackleton was faced with a situation you couldn't get around in rain.
48:12 --> 48:16 [SPEAKER_01]: So he finds out this guy Percy had wanted to get on board the ship with his best friend.
48:16 --> 48:17 [SPEAKER_01]: They come in, I think,
48:20 --> 48:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And, and the guy like let's percian, he's old enough, he seems experienced enough.
48:25 --> 48:28 [SPEAKER_01]: But his best friend is too young, it doesn't seem experienced because I can't let him on.
48:29 --> 48:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they don't let him on, but the guy sneaks him in in his sewage, or like in his baggage, keeps him there for three days.
48:38 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_01]: The third day, Aaron is shackled and finds out that this dude is stowed his best friend on board.
48:43 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_01]: How long do they think that was going last?
48:46 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_00]: along if you think you could hide a guy on a boat, it's an amazing idea.
48:51 --> 48:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and he becomes so nervous.
48:53 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_01]: So he says, in rage, he told Percy, the guy that's not onboard, he goes, you know, on missions like this where we go to Antarctica, it's the still ways that get eaten first.
49:04 --> 49:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Which, oh, what is that?
49:06 --> 49:07 [SPEAKER_00]: That's just angry right there.
49:07 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_01]: His guy is still the way he goes, well, you know, you're the first ones to be eaten when this goes back.
49:11 --> 49:12 [SPEAKER_01]: He should clearly try to scare him and shake him up.
49:13 --> 49:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And I like the guy who stowed away a lot because he responded, at least the story is true.
49:18 --> 49:20 [SPEAKER_01]: He said, I think the crew would get more meat from you,
49:22 --> 49:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Not only did you still play on his boat, but you called him fat within seconds of meeting him.
49:27 --> 49:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So you what?
49:29 --> 49:30 [SPEAKER_00]: This is what we consider a very bull.
49:31 --> 49:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I like Mercy.
49:31 --> 49:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I like this guy apparently.
49:33 --> 49:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So this is the line that followed.
49:34 --> 49:39 [SPEAKER_01]: The guy who told the story said from that point on, Shackleton always had a special sauce spot in his heart.
49:39 --> 49:46 [SPEAKER_01]: for first he giving him the job of preparing food, et cetera, and taking care of the he like he actually, this guy stood away, but he didn't punish him for it.
49:46 --> 49:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that line was so great.
49:48 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_01]: He liked his spirit.
49:49 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He was like, this guy's the kind of guy you do want to take down our custody game of especially good jobs.
49:53 --> 49:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And I got to be honest, as a teacher of my people, I totally get that.
49:57 --> 50:02 [SPEAKER_01]: When the students willing to say something like that to you and like a little when they get it, you got to love kids like that.
50:02 --> 50:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You really do.
50:03 --> 50:08 [SPEAKER_01]: But that wasn't the end, because there's another story that Percy's granddaughter tells.
50:08 --> 50:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Where shackled him was like, well, you stowed away young man, but we're gonna do one more thing to you.
50:13 --> 50:14 [SPEAKER_00]: So they tied him.
50:16 --> 50:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's see, he had a terrifying initiation ceremony to earn his place among the crew.
50:19 --> 50:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Before my granddad was properly accepted, they tied him to the front of the lifeboat in the middle of a school of killer whales.
50:27 --> 50:30 [SPEAKER_01]: which is an intense initiation ceremony.
50:30 --> 50:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You've heard of, I mean, some of you may be even went to fraternities or something like that.
50:34 --> 50:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Did they tie you to the lifeboat and sail you out in front of the killer whales?
50:38 --> 50:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's been maybe a couple of years when they stop doing that.
50:42 --> 50:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's that they got rid of them.
50:44 --> 50:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like, and especially in the Netherlands, you got to sail really far.
50:47 --> 50:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you're from the Netherlands.
50:48 --> 50:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We're a sort of sensitive to killer whales.
50:50 --> 50:51 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we don't try to have shame with them.
50:51 --> 50:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Can we even still call them killer whales?
50:53 --> 50:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Or should they be like whales that disrespect his other sea life?
51:00 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're not actually whales either if I recall.
51:02 --> 51:09 [SPEAKER_01]: So killer and they're also not killers although in the entire time shackle tumble talk about them a lot Like which is a crazy part too.
51:09 --> 51:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he's out in the ice and stuff You'd like the killer is watched us while we dealt with this situation and when he's talking about the killers He's talking about these killer whales and there's like constantly peeking over and watching them throughout their travels Killer whales don't eat people
51:23 --> 51:27 [SPEAKER_00]: But no, but like, you know, how do we know what are the people that they do not not.
51:28 --> 51:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like what are the people.
51:29 --> 51:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they do take people in their in the captivity.
51:31 --> 51:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So we do know that sometimes they attack people.
51:33 --> 51:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that the killer whales don't kill people.
51:35 --> 51:38 [SPEAKER_01]: How do we know that the people that would have been killed by them didn't get killed?
51:39 --> 51:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, at least you know they didn't get killed because a lot of people go missing out in the ocean.
51:43 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_01]: That's all the same.
51:44 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
51:44 --> 51:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So they killed the whales don't eat for sea.
51:46 --> 51:50 [SPEAKER_01]: They came up and sift and bounced them around, but they didn't even so per se was safe.
51:50 --> 51:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Once they hauled them inside the boat, Shackleton gave them a massive hug and announced, he's one of the team, it's almost like a movie, like it feels like a classic movie moment.
51:57 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're, I'm sure Shackleton has a movie or two, I've never seen them, but what a great moment.
52:01 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Also terrifying for Percy, but also also pretty cool.
52:07 --> 52:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I've seen it, I saw a YouTube video of people swimming with killer whales, and on the one hand, it definitely looks terrifying.
52:13 --> 52:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Even if they weren't called killer whales, they're still pretty scary creatures, and also so cool.
52:18 --> 52:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I would love to be able to do it myself.
52:21 --> 52:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe someday, if you find the way to an article in one of the lesser sense in those tickets, we should have our.
52:26 --> 52:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
52:27 --> 52:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, okay.
52:28 --> 52:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's make a Christian out promise here.
52:30 --> 52:35 [SPEAKER_00]: If someone sends us money for the tickets, we'll record an episode from on the chart.
52:35 --> 52:36 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll record it.
52:36 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, you know, maybe Percy was a Christian.
52:38 --> 52:39 [SPEAKER_00]: We can do an episode.
52:39 --> 52:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I got to a life potent front of killer whales guaranteed.
52:43 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Wait, wait, wait, wait.
52:44 --> 52:45 [SPEAKER_00]: We're not out.
52:45 --> 52:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the way.
52:46 --> 52:50 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, eventually the boat, the endurance gets crushed by all the ice and does sink to the bottom.
52:50 --> 52:51 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the way.
52:51 --> 52:51 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a story.
52:51 --> 52:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what's true.
52:53 --> 52:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, I can never verify any of these things, but we were there.
52:56 --> 53:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But there's a version where like, like, literally as this ship is getting crushed, like it's really getting to the end of its days.
53:01 --> 53:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Everyone is starting to tell this is the end of it.
53:04 --> 53:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And he says a group of emperor penguins come modeling up from who knows where.
53:09 --> 53:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And they start to just make like sad song sounds around them for like hours.
53:14 --> 53:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're like, it sounds like they're singing the death of our shit, basically.
53:19 --> 53:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they water off and like the next day it sinks into the ocean.
53:22 --> 53:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if that's exactly how it happened.
53:24 --> 53:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But what a weird story if it is true.
53:27 --> 53:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Like again, I choose to believe it.
53:28 --> 53:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I choose to believe the penguins came in like said goodbye boat one more time.
53:33 --> 53:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I hope that's the way it actually happened.
53:35 --> 53:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I read that I was like, that's crazy.
53:38 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_01]: They were, they had to be careful.
53:39 --> 53:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So the giving idea, we had pictures from this whole thing, but they'd be very selective, a lot of camera equipment, which is expensive back then, had to be left behind.
53:48 --> 53:59 [SPEAKER_01]: They had to kill the animals, which was very controversial because not because Pito was there, but because these people have been taking care of these animals for months at this point.
53:59 --> 54:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And that actually, I kind of, I feel like I missed somehow along the way here.
54:04 --> 54:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Shackleton had to take care when they lived on an iceberg basically for 10 months.
54:08 --> 54:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It was cold and freezing and all they could see was ice in the killers and maybe the occasional and purping when funeral song.
54:14 --> 54:16 [SPEAKER_01]: There's not a lot going on.
54:16 --> 54:18 [SPEAKER_01]: The only thing you have to do is whatever.
54:18 --> 54:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And this, I mean, being bored can drive people crazy.
54:23 --> 54:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Shackleton had to keep them entertained and he had a very strict schedule.
54:28 --> 54:31 [SPEAKER_01]: He would assign books to read and make sailors give lectures from those books.
54:32 --> 54:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He would hear like homework, that's what he did, but it worked.
54:35 --> 54:42 [SPEAKER_01]: He had them do theater skits, they would write their own theaters, and tell stories, and whatever, and also the person, but it kind of isn't a way.
54:43 --> 54:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They would have jobs, they would do races, they would do competitions, they constantly had games.
54:48 --> 54:53 [SPEAKER_01]: They each had them had something they had to do and they had to do it every day, whatever that was to keep the ship and everything going.
54:54 --> 54:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And another thing they had to do was take care of their animals.
54:56 --> 54:59 [SPEAKER_01]: They had dogs with dogs, their team, their job was to take care of them.
55:00 --> 55:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And when you kill the animals, you're saying, we're not going to Antarctica.
55:05 --> 55:07 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not getting out of this alive.
55:07 --> 55:10 [SPEAKER_01]: We're not at least getting out of this with the same mission we started.
55:10 --> 55:11 [SPEAKER_01]: This is changing now.
55:12 --> 55:15 [SPEAKER_01]: and to kill them and eat them is which is what they did.
55:15 --> 55:19 [SPEAKER_01]: They are basically saying like, we're in really bad situation.
55:19 --> 55:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And people had grown attached to their animals, obviously.
55:22 --> 55:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And as all they had to do was take care of them all day.
55:24 --> 55:29 [SPEAKER_01]: So for them to do that, it was basically saying like, I'm sorry, but but also I read the U.S.
55:29 --> 55:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Naval Institute pretty much said like, if they hadn't done it, they wouldn't die.
55:33 --> 55:34 [SPEAKER_01]: They needed that food.
55:34 --> 55:35 [SPEAKER_01]: They were in a really
55:36 --> 55:37 [SPEAKER_01]: that situation.
55:37 --> 55:46 [SPEAKER_01]: When the boat eventually just crushes and sinks through the ice and is destroyed, and goes to rest down at the bottom to not be found for 100 years.
55:46 --> 55:50 [SPEAKER_01]: They grab the last things they can out of it as they can tell it's getting ready to go down.
55:50 --> 55:58 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't even bring a full Bible because they're just trying to care of the absolute necessities, but interestingly, Shackleton did grab.
55:59 --> 56:15 [SPEAKER_01]: like pages out of the book of Psalms that he wanted with him and the following verse out of the book of Job, he ripped out because he wanted to keep and the quote in the verses out of whose womb came the ice and the ory frost of heaven who has gendered it.
56:16 --> 56:20 [SPEAKER_01]: The waters are hidden as was stone and the face of the deep frozen.
56:21 --> 56:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is a powerful verse, really.
56:22 --> 56:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that is Job describing basically Antarctica.
56:26 --> 56:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Thousands of years before anyone will ever touch Antarctica, the great frozen lands of Antarctica being described in Job pretty clearly.
56:34 --> 56:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's kind of incredible.
56:35 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_01]: You see why Shackleton had that verse on his mind.
56:38 --> 56:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he ripped that one out and took that page with them because it was important to him.
56:43 --> 56:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's another part.
56:45 --> 56:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It's quoted, I had to look for this because at first I read that this first quote was not real, but after double in cross checking it, it seems like it is.
56:52 --> 57:01 [SPEAKER_01]: The journey he wrote right around like they were going to basically make a walk and see if they could get to Antarctica across the ice and get into Antarctica and maybe start making the supply run.
57:02 --> 57:04 [SPEAKER_01]: There are food and supplies out there if they can get to them.
57:05 --> 57:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It seems to be the goal at least.
57:07 --> 57:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And so he said, in the journal, the journey would begin the next day on the Eva studying out shackles and wrote, I pray God, I can manage to get the whole party saved civilization.
57:17 --> 57:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we see, there is something of a spiritual life, a little bit, hints of it, something there.
57:23 --> 57:27 [SPEAKER_01]: They began marching, trying to get to land and see if they could go out of there.
57:27 --> 57:31 [SPEAKER_01]: After seven days of trying to cross the ice because the ice was just kind of moving with them.
57:31 --> 57:33 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so difficult, so slippery.
57:33 --> 57:34 [SPEAKER_01]: They had only made it
57:37 --> 57:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And Shackleton noted that if they kept up this pace, it would take them 300 days just to reach the soil of Antarctica, not to mention getting to the other side where the food and supplies were, this isn't going to work.
57:51 --> 57:54 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, it's crazy.
57:54 --> 57:59 [SPEAKER_00]: This story is just, it's, it's, it's a miracle.
57:59 --> 58:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that they, they made it this far or I'd like, I would, I would, I would've been dead by now.
58:04 --> 58:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I would've been frozen.
58:05 --> 58:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I would've been miserable.
58:07 --> 58:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you can't be miserable, I want you dead, but I would've, like, and these guys, they're they're powering through.
58:13 --> 58:16 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's some things you're that are, the checklists and it's doing like,
58:17 --> 58:20 [SPEAKER_00]: as the boat sings and and they're just stuck.
58:20 --> 58:21 [SPEAKER_00]: They don't know where to go.
58:21 --> 58:23 [SPEAKER_00]: A mutiny almost breaks out of the carpenter.
58:23 --> 58:26 [SPEAKER_00]: It was on the boat says, hey, we're not on a boat anymore.
58:26 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So we don't have a captain anymore, but he really keeps control.
58:30 --> 58:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty good point.
58:31 --> 58:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a good point.
58:32 --> 58:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a good point.
58:35 --> 58:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so we're all equals now.
58:37 --> 58:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if they did not have that.
58:39 --> 58:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, he takes control.
58:41 --> 58:43 [SPEAKER_00]: But anyway, also to keep the men busy.
58:43 --> 58:50 [SPEAKER_00]: So again, it says like he has the workout, to fitness, play games, activities, all these things like really to keep spirits high.
58:51 --> 58:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And another thing he did is also that he made sure that no matter what rank everyone was, they all work together.
58:58 --> 59:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we're not having like, oh, you're like the more noble person or you're
59:02 --> 59:06 [SPEAKER_00]: you were, you know, the special guy in the boat, no, everybody was pulling their weight.
59:06 --> 59:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody had to work for it.
59:07 --> 59:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And that really seems to keep the crew together.
59:11 --> 59:20 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a story also by Chekleton actually pulling a guy that's in his sleeping mix sort of like sinking into the ice as he was sleeping because the ice is cracking.
59:20 --> 59:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So they're like, they're still not,
59:23 --> 59:36 [SPEAKER_00]: actual land here like they're just walking around on ice and underneath the ice is just freezing waters and killer whales and You know all these other things so there are still walking around on the ice as we call it up here, right?
59:36 --> 59:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I know right.
59:37 --> 59:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
59:38 --> 59:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, so this is this is crazy and what actually ends up happening is that the ice pack iceberg that they're on
59:45 --> 59:49 [SPEAKER_00]: As it gets warmer, it starts to break apart, and it starts to drift out into the sea.
59:49 --> 59:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So it feels like a story that just keeps getting worse for them.
59:53 --> 59:54 [SPEAKER_01]: actually, it's true.
59:55 --> 59:58 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're out there, I mean, because they're already at this point worn out cold, tired, miserable.
59:58 --> 01:00:11 [SPEAKER_01]: They've been out here for a basically almost a year at this point when they finally start having to make their way in a different direction and they realize when they're camp, by the way, they need their camp patience, which is a good thing for a camp way up.
01:00:11 --> 01:00:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think they had been here about three months when they finally had go, like this isn't working.
01:00:14 --> 01:00:16 [SPEAKER_01]: The ice started to split the camp apart.
01:00:16 --> 01:00:19 [SPEAKER_01]: and they realize we're not safe here but we're not going to make it to Antarctica either.
01:00:20 --> 01:00:32 [SPEAKER_01]: We've got to try something else so they get back to their lifeboats and they start to cross the sea where the ice isn't and start sailing towards an area called elephant island.
01:00:32 --> 01:00:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Now this isn't island, I'll off the side of Antarctica.
01:00:35 --> 01:00:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Famous for its elephants, the Antarctic elephants, I believe.
01:00:38 --> 01:00:39 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I don't know why.
01:00:40 --> 01:00:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I bet if you look it up it just is like shaped like an elephant.
01:00:43 --> 01:00:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what, the way that oilers called it that, that was it, it was whalers had sailed around that area and occasionally used it to drop off and do work while they were chasing whale oil back in the late 1800s when we didn't get our oil out of the ground, we got it out of whales.
01:00:58 --> 01:01:07 [SPEAKER_01]: There was a church chapel there so they kind of had the open idea like if we get to this island maybe we can build a boat or we can build some shelters and survive longer.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:11 [SPEAKER_01]: when they they sail there and it's a very difficult voyage.
01:01:11 --> 01:01:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I believe at one point the captain of one of the crews warsley the guy that shackled ten of confided in earlier he was leading one of the three lifeboats and when they arrived at elephant island it was such a dangerous
01:01:23 --> 01:01:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Extreme reach to get there.
01:01:26 --> 01:01:45 [SPEAKER_01]: He had been awake for over 80 hours getting his men there and that I'm sure his last night sleep wasn't like 12 before he did it I really reminds me of Paul and like in the book of Axe where he's like, hey guys, nobody's eaten in 14 days Maybe we should have a snack before we do this next part like like this is rough rough sailing conditions
01:01:45 --> 01:01:57 [SPEAKER_01]: and they do get to Elephant Island, they kind of want it considered going further to another island called Deception Island, which would get them more in the tracking lanes of the wailers and get them a better chance of getting rescued.
01:01:58 --> 01:02:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But Jacqueline realized they had a problem.
01:02:01 --> 01:02:02 [SPEAKER_01]: His men weren't strong enough.
01:02:03 --> 01:02:05 [SPEAKER_01]: is, is people are going to make it, which is a fair sign.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's been, I think it's, and that got easier about a year and a couple months of this much drama and stuff.
01:02:12 --> 01:02:15 [SPEAKER_01]: They're just not, they're not up for getting into deception island.
01:02:15 --> 01:02:20 [SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing that they made it to elicit island alive and it just, it's not going to happen.
01:02:20 --> 01:02:33 [SPEAKER_01]: but they also can't stay on elephant island elephant island had been used by whalers here in there once in a while but it was not a commonly used island for whalers and even if they did land on elephant island such a big island how would you know where they were going to land.
01:02:34 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not a good spot to be.
01:02:35 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_01]: There is
01:02:36 --> 01:02:38 [SPEAKER_01]: two other places you can go.
01:02:38 --> 01:02:39 [SPEAKER_01]: One is the Faulklin Islands.
01:02:39 --> 01:02:44 [SPEAKER_01]: They are technically closer to you, but the conditions to get there are going against the wind you're not gonna reach it.
01:02:44 --> 01:02:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So then you have to go to another place called South Georgia.
01:02:47 --> 01:02:59 [SPEAKER_01]: However, South Georgia is 800 miles away and you're crossing Antarctic sea storms, all the icebergs, all the wind, all the drama of that sea.
01:03:00 --> 01:03:20 [SPEAKER_01]: on a lifeboat, not exactly a great idea, but he picks a crew and they set sail, and this is suicide, but there's no chance you're going to make it, but they try and they begin sailing and they go up against hurricane force winds.
01:03:21 --> 01:03:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Literally, I'm not being sarcastic, like it's really strong when they are literally hurricane force winds, they say that they were up against 60 foot tall waves, which is very likely if you look at videos of Antarctica, like weather, this is not a good part of the world to be sailing in.
01:03:39 --> 01:03:40 [SPEAKER_01]: The boat would have problems.
01:03:41 --> 01:03:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Oftentimes the boat would get hit and with parts of it would break off and you have to repair it as you're sailing because you don't have any choices.
01:03:49 --> 01:03:55 [SPEAKER_01]: The whole time, every time the water splashes, the coldest ICS waters are spraying on you, you can't exactly start a fire.
01:03:57 --> 01:04:00 [SPEAKER_01]: you're starving, they don't have the food to deal with this.
01:04:01 --> 01:04:02 [SPEAKER_01]: They're dehydrated.
01:04:02 --> 01:04:08 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, many men throughout this adventure had begun to drink sea water, which causes lots of problems.
01:04:08 --> 01:04:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Suppose, I mean, I don't know how much they ate, but it was the thing.
01:04:12 --> 01:04:19 [SPEAKER_01]: They were using reindeer fur sleeping bags, but this much pressure in the water had begun to destroy them.
01:04:20 --> 01:04:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And the wind's and currents were constantly changing.
01:04:23 --> 01:04:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So even as you were trying to sail the 800 miles, you were constantly being thrown off course because again, this is horrible, horrible sailing conditions.
01:04:32 --> 01:04:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's even one story that I found where there was a storm like in that exact area, like a much bigger wailing boat sunk in that storm.
01:04:42 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And they are like in this small open,
01:04:45 --> 01:05:06 [SPEAKER_00]: open boat and they they managed they managed it's amazing they guess they got there up and as they arrived so that big storm is sinking a wailing ship on one side of the island while they're arriving on the other side of the island going through the same storm crazy yeah so but they do make it to the island so they make it to South Georgia and you know 16 days
01:05:07 --> 01:05:10 [SPEAKER_00]: and if you're cheering now, you know, wherever you are cheering like, oh, they made it.
01:05:10 --> 01:05:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It's amazing.
01:05:11 --> 01:05:22 [SPEAKER_00]: They had a problem because they were on the wrong side of the island and because of all the currents and all the eyes and everything and it wasn't possible to go around the island by boat.
01:05:22 --> 01:05:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like it's crazy.
01:05:23 --> 01:05:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like it made it that far.
01:05:25 --> 01:05:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Just sail a little bit further, right?
01:05:27 --> 01:05:28 [SPEAKER_01]: But apparently not.
01:05:28 --> 01:05:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, considering these guys that sailed since 16 days and 800 miles to get to this point, they probably knew what they were talking about when they said, you can't sail to the other side of it.
01:05:38 --> 01:05:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But again, that's just crazy to me.
01:05:40 --> 01:05:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep, so, but it leaves him with only one option.
01:05:43 --> 01:05:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Cross.
01:05:44 --> 01:05:48 [SPEAKER_01]: An uncharted, unnapped island that no one has ever crossed before.
01:05:49 --> 01:05:54 [SPEAKER_01]: That it, that has multiple mountain peaks and glaciers on it.
01:05:55 --> 01:05:55 [SPEAKER_01]: That.
01:05:56 --> 01:05:59 [SPEAKER_01]: with one wrong slip, you will go off the side of the mountain and never be seen again.
01:05:59 --> 01:06:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And you're going to cross it after you've just finished at 16th age journey after you just finished getting to elephant island after you just finished three months at patients camp after you just finished 10 months stuck in a iceberg.
01:06:11 --> 01:06:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Everything's been going wrong.
01:06:12 --> 01:06:14 [SPEAKER_01]: You're starving, hungry, entire dollet stuff.
01:06:14 --> 01:06:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And you're now going to cross South Georgia and pray to God that you get
01:06:25 --> 01:06:32 [SPEAKER_01]: If you made that far, everyone's counting on you and you slip and you go down a mountain and all of that hard work would be for nothing, it's just amazing.
01:06:33 --> 01:06:36 [SPEAKER_01]: So there is three, I believe I read three, four thousand foot mountains that they have to cross.
01:06:37 --> 01:06:39 [SPEAKER_01]: They are not like hills, they are steep.
01:06:40 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_01]: jagged edge horrible mountains that they're crossing and they'll go out at the peak of one and I'll see the peak of another and they'll go back down and go out the peak of one.
01:06:47 --> 01:06:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm back down there to do the again, they do this again and again to the third one and it's becoming night.
01:06:51 --> 01:06:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It's foggy.
01:06:52 --> 01:07:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It's one wrong step and you die but it's too cold to spin the night at the top of that mountain and warously said basically they decided to just slide.
01:07:04 --> 01:07:30 [SPEAKER_01]: town to snow with a mountain and basically if we're going to we're going to make it we're going to make it for not we're not but let's go and so they slide down the mountain and I mean if you know anything about glaciers you see any kind of videos I mean just one wrong lurch and you go into a hole and I've never seen again I mean it would take nothing for this to be death and wordsly himself said that but this was the most terrifying moment of his life and remember he had just been 16 days at
01:07:33 --> 01:07:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But this was the most terrifying moment of life as he slid down a mountain with any moment you could die.
01:07:41 --> 01:07:42 [SPEAKER_01]: They get to the bottom.
01:07:42 --> 01:07:43 [SPEAKER_01]: They live obviously.
01:07:43 --> 01:07:48 [SPEAKER_01]: 36 hours of crossing this island of this island that no one had ever crossed before.
01:07:49 --> 01:07:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And they hear the sound of whistles.
01:07:53 --> 01:07:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And the whistles are the whalers whistles.
01:07:56 --> 01:07:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That was the whistle they sent to be like, hey, whales have been spotted.
01:07:59 --> 01:08:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's get out and go.
01:08:00 --> 01:08:02 [SPEAKER_01]: They reached civilization.
01:08:02 --> 01:08:05 [SPEAKER_01]: They reached people and the civilizations are going to outpost in the middle of nowhere.
01:08:05 --> 01:08:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But to them, that is other people that we talking to people, they don't know for the first time, in almost two years.
01:08:12 --> 01:08:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:08:12 --> 01:08:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But I mean, yeah, they've been out there just with their own little crew.
01:08:16 --> 01:08:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So that must have been an amazing moment for them to find other people.
01:08:19 --> 01:08:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
01:08:19 --> 01:08:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say
01:08:22 --> 01:08:27 [SPEAKER_00]: which is one way to cut, but it kind of sounds like, you know, let's go for a little walk, you know, let's say John's.
01:08:27 --> 01:08:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's role.
01:08:29 --> 01:08:30 [SPEAKER_00]: No, this was not as troll.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:34 [SPEAKER_01]: This is, I mean, to be fair, Shackleton didn't get into the history of books for crossing Antarctica.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:37 [SPEAKER_01]: The first time, but he was the first person across South Georgia.
01:08:38 --> 01:08:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's, that's a fair point.
01:08:40 --> 01:08:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if he's very known for it, well, I mean, this walk is very known.
01:08:43 --> 01:08:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And so they end up at the
01:08:47 --> 01:08:58 [SPEAKER_00]: you know, they're looking out to see there's the boats and then suddenly like three guys walk up behind and like, hey, hi, we came from that way and they're like, how is that possible?
01:08:58 --> 01:08:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it had never happened.
01:08:59 --> 01:09:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So people were super surprised.
01:09:01 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_00]: They looked terrible.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:10 [SPEAKER_00]: They so their hairs and beard stringy and matted their faces blackened with suit from blubber stoves and
01:09:16 --> 01:09:26 [SPEAKER_00]: but they made it and they're actually in so terrible the shape that the manager of the wailing station in our region guy called Dorof Sérla.
01:09:27 --> 01:09:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm really glad you were here for that because I definitely want to said morale sorely.
01:09:31 --> 01:09:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you see, you see the weird.
01:09:32 --> 01:09:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, in the script, right?
01:09:33 --> 01:09:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's uh, uh, I can't see.
01:09:35 --> 01:09:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like an oath of slasher.
01:09:37 --> 01:09:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:09:37 --> 01:09:39 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, sir, sir.
01:09:39 --> 01:09:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Sir, sir.
01:09:40 --> 01:09:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:09:40 --> 01:09:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So I learned something.
01:09:41 --> 01:09:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:09:41 --> 01:09:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:09:42 --> 01:09:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, anyway, here, and now there's going to be no region people in the country.
01:09:46 --> 01:09:47 [SPEAKER_00]: No, he said it wrong.
01:09:47 --> 01:09:48 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but.
01:09:48 --> 01:09:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, I'm probably closer than Troy was, so let's just take it, but the manager, he's like, like, who are you?
01:09:55 --> 01:10:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And the terrible bearded man in the center of the three set very quietly, my name is Sheckleton.
01:10:02 --> 01:10:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's a name.
01:10:03 --> 01:10:06 [SPEAKER_00]: They know, so they make it.
01:10:07 --> 01:10:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And now, of course, they have to go back.
01:10:09 --> 01:10:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And this, I actually,
01:10:11 --> 01:10:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Like you read it and you're like, Oh, wow, it really took a long, but just just bear with me.
01:10:15 --> 01:10:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So the other 22 men, they're still on elephant island.
01:10:21 --> 01:10:25 [SPEAKER_00]: It takes three ships and months to still get there.
01:10:26 --> 01:10:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Even though Shackleton and these two other guys took 16 days to get from elephant island to South Georgia, it takes them months to circle back basically and get these 22 people.
01:10:40 --> 01:10:50 [SPEAKER_01]: What they did is just actually yes, it's absolutely amazing and one of the it's just seems like each time they tried to get They got close to elephant island, but the ice and stuff kept them from getting all the way.
01:10:50 --> 01:10:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You're right.
01:10:50 --> 01:10:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It actually makes it even more unbelievable That on a life vote these guys were able to do what you know the professional wailers couldn't do
01:10:58 --> 01:11:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but they do it.
01:11:01 --> 01:11:03 [SPEAKER_00]: They get back 22 men still alive.
01:11:04 --> 01:11:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And many of them had actually already given up hope because, you know, they saw their captain.
01:11:09 --> 01:11:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So, apparently the line they would go in a life boat.
01:11:12 --> 01:11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they would say the line they would say is that the guys in charge would be like, hey, keep the camp clean, keep spirits high today, the boss, which is what they call a shackle to might come back.
01:11:20 --> 01:11:31 [SPEAKER_01]: But some of the guys were kind of like hey, he's not coming back like obviously he went in a roadboat for granted I'm not a robot, but like a lifeboat He's dead and even if he's not dead like he's not gonna.
01:11:31 --> 01:11:46 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no it's no way you could have done it So I cannot imagine the shock on those guys as faces when months later They showed that boat showed up in shaggleton in the guys were like look here We're not as dead as he thought and likewise imagine the shock on the shaggleton's face
01:11:48 --> 01:11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: all 22 still there.
01:11:50 --> 01:11:51 [SPEAKER_00]: It's amazing.
01:11:51 --> 01:11:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So they all make it back like the whole crew.
01:11:55 --> 01:11:57 [SPEAKER_00]: They make it back.
01:11:58 --> 01:12:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be really honest here because it says 22 men in the sources that we found they went with three.
01:12:03 --> 01:12:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm missing some people still from the 28 that they set off it, but maybe they I don't know.
01:12:09 --> 01:12:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe there's three of them saying at the bottom of South Georgia, about the three walks here.
01:12:12 --> 01:12:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know you're right.
01:12:13 --> 01:12:14 [SPEAKER_01]: The math is not it could be.
01:12:14 --> 01:12:15 [SPEAKER_00]: There isn't.
01:12:15 --> 01:12:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I think he had his lifeboat with them six, but only three of them cross South Georgia.
01:12:19 --> 01:12:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe he only took the strongest to actually cross.
01:12:21 --> 01:12:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.
01:12:22 --> 01:12:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I know you did that, sir.
01:12:23 --> 01:12:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Good question though.
01:12:24 --> 01:12:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, at least like all the sources do say, he he comes back without losing a single soul that was on the entrance.
01:12:32 --> 01:12:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Including the sto away.
01:12:33 --> 01:12:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Who might have regretted their decision by this place?
01:12:36 --> 01:12:41 [SPEAKER_00]: He probably regretted it after the well, the killer well incident already, but who knows?
01:12:41 --> 01:12:43 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's it.
01:12:43 --> 01:12:45 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the end of the expedition.
01:12:46 --> 01:12:52 [SPEAKER_00]: They make it back to Britain and he tries to make one final expedition.
01:12:53 --> 01:13:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But Sheckleton, his poor health, his heart that was actually giving him trouble all his life Finally gives up and he passes away on the island of South Georgia where he first made this this incredible journey He walked 36 hours over these mountains and on this island He actually passes away before he can depart on his final expedition to Antarctica
01:13:17 --> 01:13:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, they tried to bring his body back with him to Britain, but actually on the way to Britain his wife since it telegram and says like, hey, no, bring back to South Georgia and very in there because that's where you should be, it's pretty sweet.
01:13:31 --> 01:13:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Also, how weird would it be to the wife of a guy who like disappears for like three to five years at.
01:13:38 --> 01:13:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel that I feel that was strangely common in those days.
01:13:41 --> 01:13:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It was David Larson as a similar situation with his wife like 50 years before that.
01:13:45 --> 01:13:49 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it was more common, but I can't imagine it made life easy.
01:13:50 --> 01:13:53 [SPEAKER_01]: But we also took some veterans of that last expedition with him.
01:13:54 --> 01:13:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So there were people who went with him.
01:13:57 --> 01:14:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So this horrible expedition and we're like, yeah, let's go back and do it again, boss.
01:14:00 --> 01:14:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I mean, that to me alone tells you more about Shackleton's character than anything else
01:14:08 --> 01:14:13 [SPEAKER_01]: all stretch the imagination, a failure in terms of what they set out to do.
01:14:14 --> 01:14:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And yet, people said, I'll go with you again and try one more time.
01:14:17 --> 01:14:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You could not pay me the enough money on Earth try that.
01:14:21 --> 01:14:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And I guarantee you, Shackles, it wasn't paying the match at all.
01:14:23 --> 01:14:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, these people had had basically cheated that.
01:14:26 --> 01:14:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Like they, they were by all accounts.
01:14:28 --> 01:14:29 [SPEAKER_00]: They shouldn't have made it.
01:14:30 --> 01:14:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And they made it.
01:14:31 --> 01:14:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And Shackles and says, hey, want to go again.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And these guys, there's a couple of them that are like, let's go.
01:14:36 --> 01:14:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm in.
01:14:37 --> 01:14:42 [SPEAKER_01]: They, so when Shackleton dies, the crew that was there does make an intent to get there on our car, they don't really reach it.
01:14:43 --> 01:14:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So then they have an actually go past elephant island and the people who were those veterans actually sailed past the beach where they had all been stranded.
01:14:51 --> 01:14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And I can only imagine there were probably some, some probably tears, you know, and I'm only some feelings as they passed that spot.
01:14:57 --> 01:15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they went back to the UK after that, the expedition was again another failure.
01:15:01 --> 01:15:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So even after he died, he was still creating failed expeditions.
01:15:05 --> 01:15:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, an amazing story and he had other things going on his life like he'd get a little bit involved with World War I all though to be honest and not very much.
01:15:12 --> 01:15:24 [SPEAKER_01]: He kind of gave advice on how to like, if Britain had to do stuff in Russia and the icy parts, that was kind of his part of it, like since the guy gets, guy knows ice and snow better than your average guy, um, but we one thing we have not answered.
01:15:24 --> 01:15:28 [SPEAKER_01]: One piece we are missing is, was he a Christian or not?
01:15:34 --> 01:15:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I mean, what a story and unlike other stories we've done and like Dickens or other stories where it is like more Christiany woven throughout the story.
01:15:46 --> 01:15:50 [SPEAKER_00]: This one we haven't mentioned a lot, I think it came up of course with the psalm.
01:15:51 --> 01:15:55 [SPEAKER_00]: The Bible that was on board and some a quote where he did write about like,
01:15:57 --> 01:16:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I pray to God that I can bring all these men back to civilization.
01:16:01 --> 01:16:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, there is already right away a case to be made that God answered his prayers because he was able to bring all his men back to civilization.
01:16:10 --> 01:16:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And there are some things.
01:16:11 --> 01:16:16 [SPEAKER_00]: There are things on the plus side things on the not so plus side.
01:16:17 --> 01:16:21 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the first things that comes up and you already like alluded to it that way at the beginning.
01:16:22 --> 01:16:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And he had a bit of a drinking problem.
01:16:25 --> 01:16:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he wasn't alcoholic.
01:16:27 --> 01:16:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Had to keep warm, I don't know, yeah, I C C. Well, yeah, I mean, it's, it's a stereotype, but it's a stereotype for a reason.
01:16:35 --> 01:16:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I think a lot of sailors like drinking and so did Shackleton.
01:16:39 --> 01:16:41 [SPEAKER_00]: And he was also known to be,
01:16:41 --> 01:16:45 [SPEAKER_01]: A womanizer, even though he was married, fell for lead to it, and why is it clear?
01:16:45 --> 01:16:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to be, I wrote that down, but I had some thoughts on that, which was, he got along very well with the wealthy ladies, while he was raising support.
01:16:54 --> 01:16:58 [SPEAKER_01]: But I couldn't tell, and maybe this might be where your comments come in and help me out.
01:16:59 --> 01:17:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't tell with that meant like he did have a reputation for being around a lot of different women, or it was just that he was a charmer in that kind of society.
01:17:09 --> 01:17:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Some people were like, yes, he was definitely a womanizer, he definitely was cheating with all his wife with all his different women.
01:17:15 --> 01:17:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And other people were kind of like, no, he's just like, he was good with, he was good at what he did and raising stuff where you could both get you through an Antarctic expedition, but he can also charm you out of your money if you're wealthy woman and they love this rugged adventure guy with all of those adventure stories.
01:17:29 --> 01:17:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you look at your living in England at the time with your Lord's New Year ladies and all that stuff, this guy telling you about, you know, killer whales and Emperor penguins seeing funeral songs is probably a hit at any party.
01:17:40 --> 01:17:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure that would make you fun.
01:17:42 --> 01:17:45 [SPEAKER_01]: So, maybe that's one where I, my research shouldn't get me far enough.
01:17:45 --> 01:17:47 [SPEAKER_01]: You have the answer to that and you're like, no, no, no, no.
01:17:47 --> 01:17:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I am the great-great-grandchild of, you know, or Shackleton via another wife or something.
01:17:51 --> 01:17:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:17:51 --> 01:17:53 [SPEAKER_00]: You have the information that I didn't find.
01:17:53 --> 01:17:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me know.
01:17:54 --> 01:17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but so I don't want to say for sure.
01:17:56 --> 01:17:57 [SPEAKER_01]: He was a woman.
01:17:57 --> 01:18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't a clear cut enough.
01:18:00 --> 01:18:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It just seemed like it was, it was a, it's been a myth on part of the myth.
01:18:04 --> 01:18:21 [SPEAKER_00]: That was a, well, and what we do know, like he was, uh, he was married, uh, for all of his years, which weren't as many as maybe could have been if he wasn't an, and, and Arctic explorer, um, he had one wife and he, uh, stayed faithful to her by all available accounts.
01:18:21 --> 01:18:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So,
01:18:23 --> 01:18:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But then there is a very fascinating story that is written about a lot and it's called a fourth-man story which of course comes from the story of the friends of Daniel in the fire like there is a fourth-man in the fire and this is actually where they go.
01:18:41 --> 01:18:46 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not there, and that's a song by Hillsley.
01:18:46 --> 01:18:55 [SPEAKER_01]: He's also a TS Eliot quote that actually like one of he wrote of his poet or a poem or something based on this story and he even says like I read it in the shackles and story I think.
01:18:55 --> 01:19:03 [SPEAKER_01]: But basically like there's these guys traveling in Arizona like that he says I looked back when I kept seeing another footsteps beside us or something like that.
01:19:03 --> 01:19:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And he said so this story is inspired what I'm saying like a lot of discussion and what's the story?
01:19:10 --> 01:19:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so the story is, and this is, they lend it their lifeboat on the wrong side of South Georgia, basically, and they have to cross the island.
01:19:21 --> 01:19:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And they all, the three men,
01:19:30 --> 01:19:40 [SPEAKER_00]: have this separate from each other, the story that during the March of 36 hours, there was a fourth presence, a fourth man with them.
01:19:41 --> 01:19:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So here's a quote directly to Shekleton.
01:19:46 --> 01:19:47 [SPEAKER_00]: He wrote in 1917, I know
01:19:48 --> 01:19:59 [SPEAKER_00]: that during that long and wrecking march of 36 hours over the unnamed mountains and glaciers of South Georgia, it seemed to me often that there were four, not three.
01:19:59 --> 01:20:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And then there is another quote actually like, Wersley also gives the same quote.
01:20:04 --> 01:20:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And then later he says, Shecklton, however, had a very clear view of where the person came from.
01:20:11 --> 01:20:24 [SPEAKER_00]: When I look back on those days, I have no doubt that Providence guided us across, not only across those snow fields, but across the Storm White Sea that separated Elephant Island from our landing place on South Georgia.
01:20:25 --> 01:20:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So what I'm at least seeing here is like a knowledge of God, but also a feeling like God is guiding him.
01:20:35 --> 01:20:38 [SPEAKER_00]: And we of course have the prayer as well earlier on in the story.
01:20:40 --> 01:21:02 [SPEAKER_00]: So, these are some things that I find interesting, and there's another one where you also is quoted as saying as he is, and this is actually, I don't have a time for this quote, so this could have been during any of his expeditions, too, and Artica where he says, we had pierced the veneer of outtight things, we had seen God in his splendors, we had heard the text at nature when this, we had reached the naked soul of men,
01:21:05 --> 01:21:23 [SPEAKER_00]: an inhabital place is now like this is like where regards in charge and this is where we see his splendor where men really has nothing to say for himself and where men cannot have any kind of you know anything to boast in that's at least how I read the quote here.
01:21:25 --> 01:21:40 [SPEAKER_00]: There are no clear signs of him, like we don't have a council and like oh, and then he did a Bible study with the group every morning or then he read his Bible or then they did a church service every Sunday while they were out on the ice or when he wasn't in the UK.
01:21:41 --> 01:21:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Actually on the contrary, like,
01:21:44 --> 01:21:52 [SPEAKER_00]: It's probably very probable that even when he was in Britain, when he was on land, he didn't attend church.
01:21:52 --> 01:21:58 [SPEAKER_00]: He, there was really no evidence of that part of a Christian life.
01:21:58 --> 01:22:00 [SPEAKER_00]: So Troy, what do you think?
01:22:01 --> 01:22:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So we're making our final judgments here?
01:22:03 --> 01:22:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, or if you have some other quotes, other input that we've missed?
01:22:06 --> 01:22:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's about shackled tenants.
01:22:07 --> 01:22:08 [SPEAKER_01]: There's not a lot.
01:22:08 --> 01:22:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you said, there's not a lot there.
01:22:12 --> 01:22:26 [SPEAKER_01]: definitely has moments where he's acknowledging that there is a God on some oil, a praying and you know, is clear attachment to the Bible and that, you know, verse from Joe, which is a point to that.
01:22:27 --> 01:22:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I, it's funny after reading this expedition and reading that I read that verse where I read Joe several times.
01:22:31 --> 01:22:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I'd never, would have made that connection to this kind of the world.
01:22:34 --> 01:22:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But when he puts it there, it's like, well, that is exactly what this would look like.
01:22:38 --> 01:22:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Anything about Joe, we were like, Joe, we lived in the Middle East, how did you know about the womb of ice and all that?
01:22:43 --> 01:22:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, if you're not God is not leaving that way, we're going to get that from.
01:22:46 --> 01:22:51 [SPEAKER_01]: But as a different story, uh, uh, that's the problem.
01:22:51 --> 01:22:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel like I can add a lot more to it.
01:22:53 --> 01:22:57 [SPEAKER_01]: We know that he has his drinking problem, which doesn't mean he's not a Christian, it just is a problem.
01:22:58 --> 01:23:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, we have the womanizing maybe thing, but it does seem like he was faithful to his
01:23:04 --> 01:23:06 [SPEAKER_01]: and we have a couple of quotes that we mentioned.
01:23:07 --> 01:23:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's a pretty much all there is in his story to point us to Christianity.
01:23:16 --> 01:23:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Now he is like some people would say no, he was a Christian explorer, he's one of them, but
01:23:22 --> 01:23:29 [SPEAKER_01]: How can we say he's a Christian explorer without more evidence or him being a Christian explorer than this?
01:23:29 --> 01:23:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So to me, I'm like, ah, no, I also would say I don't have evidence that he's not a Christian either.
01:23:35 --> 01:23:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't see any proof that throughout any of this that he didn't believe in God.
01:23:39 --> 01:23:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't see any proof that he was denying the Lord or anything like that.
01:23:43 --> 01:23:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't see much proof one way or the other.
01:23:45 --> 01:23:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I just see a little snapshot here and there of him mentioning God, but it not going deeper than
01:23:52 --> 01:24:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, there is actually one thing that I haven't mentioned yet, but there's a lot of stuff from one of his crewmates, a man named Hurley, who had a diary, and he did notice like he did write down his diary like for Christmas they would do services.
01:24:08 --> 01:24:31 [SPEAKER_00]: for other special religious holidays, they would do, and they were actually moments of prayer, like before they set out, so this is from this one men's diary, he said that they did pray, before they set out to South Georgia, or moments of prayer, apparently Sheckleton, or someone from the crew, read Psalm 23, as the boat sank in the ice.
01:24:33 --> 01:24:34 [SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of beautiful.
01:24:34 --> 01:24:41 [SPEAKER_01]: That's actually maybe even more beautiful than the in the in the in burping one song You know, I mean and probably a little bit more.
01:24:41 --> 01:24:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say more meaningful and then the penguins And now it was a little bit of what in burping one sound like so we could have played that clip or something But anyway, I need that fitting.
01:24:52 --> 01:24:54 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a eight-throw walk to the value of death
01:24:55 --> 01:24:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's pretty, I mean, that's, that's gonna be power feds.
01:24:57 --> 01:24:59 [SPEAKER_00]: It's powerful stuff.
01:24:59 --> 01:25:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So, so there's a lot of like bits and pieces.
01:25:03 --> 01:25:03 [SPEAKER_00]: There's hints.
01:25:03 --> 01:25:10 [SPEAKER_00]: There's like, like, there's not like a clear line, but what I really, really, really like about the story of Shackleton.
01:25:10 --> 01:25:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Like,
01:25:12 --> 01:25:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me feel like this.
01:25:13 --> 01:25:18 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked, for example, let's say men like Charles Dickens.
01:25:18 --> 01:25:19 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about him, we didn't episode in him.
01:25:20 --> 01:25:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And there are things where he's saying things.
01:25:22 --> 01:25:23 [SPEAKER_00]: He's not showing things.
01:25:24 --> 01:25:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But checkleton, okay, maybe he's not saying things.
01:25:27 --> 01:25:28 [SPEAKER_00]: He's definitely showing things.
01:25:28 --> 01:25:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the leadership, the care for his men, the care for it to bring them all back alive.
01:25:33 --> 01:25:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he?
01:25:35 --> 01:25:52 [SPEAKER_00]: We did Francis Drake like he abandoned his his main friend like as soon as he thought like okay well disaster sharks, you know his boat got hit by a fireboat and he just bolts it the other way like he's out of there like sheckles and like like with the tree guys like they could have been like
01:25:53 --> 01:25:58 [SPEAKER_00]: those 22 men, they probably don't count on me, they probably don't count on us coming back, they probably think we're dead.
01:25:59 --> 01:26:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Like by all kinds, like he could have gone, he could have said, oh, day Paris, like who's gonna tell?
01:26:04 --> 01:26:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Like who's ever gonna say like, oh no, they were still alive when you left them or something, like he could have told any story and gotten out easier.
01:26:12 --> 01:26:14 [SPEAKER_00]: But he did not, like he cared for his men.
01:26:15 --> 01:26:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, you got to be a pretty terrible guy to leave 22 people to die on an iron that you were going to save.
01:26:20 --> 01:26:24 [SPEAKER_00]: But still, there were other paths to take, but he didn't.
01:26:24 --> 01:26:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, he is really taking care of his people.
01:26:26 --> 01:26:31 [SPEAKER_00]: He, he, I mean, even, and that speaks to his character.
01:26:31 --> 01:26:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Even though he treats the still way, right?
01:26:33 --> 01:26:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, the way that he,
01:26:35 --> 01:26:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He initiated and said that nobody could claim, you know, he used to look at the killer well thing.
01:26:40 --> 01:26:48 [SPEAKER_01]: He got some hazing thing, but what he was really telling, I mean, you can also see as a leader, he's saying this guy didn't come the right way, but we're going to treat him like we like he did.
01:26:49 --> 01:26:50 [SPEAKER_01]: By going through that whole situation.
01:26:50 --> 01:26:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he had the crew had fun with them, but he also, I mean, these are sailors.
01:26:53 --> 01:26:57 [SPEAKER_01]: He's kind of getting them on his side by making him go with his speak.
01:26:58 --> 01:27:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So from just point A from top to bottom, I think it was one of the guys who first climbed Mount Everest said that the greatest leader that ever like lived was Ernest Shackleton, and I could definitely say like at least in terms of like, you know, not biblical leader days, he's definitely one of the greatest leaders that you have.
01:27:15 --> 01:27:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you ask me what I want to cost an article with anyone else, the answer is probably not.
01:27:20 --> 01:27:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's my guy.
01:27:22 --> 01:27:22 [SPEAKER_01]: If I'm going to go to
01:27:28 --> 01:27:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I don't think we have definitive proof.
01:27:34 --> 01:27:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't really like him to be.
01:27:36 --> 01:27:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I would really like him to be.
01:27:41 --> 01:27:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Because of what he's showing.
01:27:42 --> 01:27:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, let me put it like this.
01:27:44 --> 01:27:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm earn a shackle to an aside.
01:27:46 --> 01:27:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is what we want to see in our leader.
01:27:51 --> 01:27:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We want to see someone that just goes before the trip, but not in a way.
01:27:55 --> 01:28:01 [SPEAKER_00]: recklessly like and you just got to follow because you don't have a choice but he's He's keeping the group together.
01:28:01 --> 01:28:15 [SPEAKER_00]: He cares for every single person even the store away like This is I think what leadership should look like in in in a discipleship in a Christ like setting so so I'm seeing that so that's why I'm saying like I would
01:28:16 --> 01:28:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I would really want him to be a Christian, just because this is what I would want Christian leadership to look like.
01:28:23 --> 01:28:25 [SPEAKER_00]: That's maybe the point I'm trying to make here.
01:28:25 --> 01:28:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So what we can learn, like we can definitely learn from even if he's a Christian or not, like we can learn from him like this dedication to his men and
01:28:35 --> 01:28:49 [SPEAKER_00]: And really going to the the furthest of Lang City could possibly humanly go to with a heart that is not functioning well like and he's you know going over rough oceans is going over mountains to get his men to safety
01:28:50 --> 01:28:56 [SPEAKER_00]: And that just really speaks to his character and I really think that's something that we can learn.
01:28:56 --> 01:29:05 [SPEAKER_00]: If we're in leadership position or not, but that care for the other person, like caring for your fellow crew made for your fellow men,
01:29:06 --> 01:29:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's absolutely beautiful and I think that's a great lesson.
01:29:11 --> 01:29:12 [SPEAKER_00]: We can learn it from him.
01:29:13 --> 01:29:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I really want him to be a Christian.
01:29:17 --> 01:29:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we have found enough proof.
01:29:19 --> 01:29:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So for this one, I'm really calling you up in the comments like maybe do some research like help us out.
01:29:24 --> 01:29:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, like, isn't this what we would want to be aspiring to?
01:29:28 --> 01:29:29 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm saying here.
01:29:29 --> 01:29:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:29:30 --> 01:29:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I think where I would land with him, my call is a million, yes, with what little information we have.
01:29:40 --> 01:29:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, John Flavel was a Puritan minister in the 1600s, and he crazy story.
01:29:45 --> 01:29:52 [SPEAKER_01]: He has a guy who got saved, and it is one of the weird, it is very fact, like we know the name of the sky, can't remember whose name right now, because I'm not.
01:29:52 --> 01:30:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Memorize every name in the 1700s, but he breached on behind all right, but and they like 16 90 something he preached to like one of his final like it was last couple years of minister He preached to some people in a family that was listening like that week went to America And one of the people that went to America uh this kid it was like 15 years old and he would live to be 105
01:30:16 --> 01:30:26 [SPEAKER_01]: very long time, I even had the Google, the person I heard this story, I can't be real though, nobody looked me 105, this guy did, it's verified, we kind of know what to say was.
01:30:26 --> 01:30:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the age of one,
01:30:29 --> 01:30:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Endured.
01:30:30 --> 01:30:54 [SPEAKER_01]: He came to Christ and he lived his entire life as a total just loser drinking being vulgar not a great guy and he said he was in the field one day and he just like his brain flashback to that sermon by John Flavel that he had heard when he was a kid something he had completely forgotten and he said that while he was in like why was in this weird flashback memory thing
01:30:56 --> 01:31:00 [SPEAKER_01]: John Flivell was preaching to him like, hey, you need to know the Lord and you're going to you're a bad person.
01:31:01 --> 01:31:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And he started arguing like in his head with him like, well, I'm not that bad person.
01:31:05 --> 01:31:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And it was like everything he came up with, John Flivell's next line of the sermon that he was remembered exactly matched what he was hearing.
01:31:12 --> 01:31:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And he came to Christ.
01:31:13 --> 01:31:16 [SPEAKER_01]: He lived another five years to be 105.
01:31:16 --> 01:31:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And everyone, everyone in the town was like, he was a completely different person.
01:31:19 --> 01:31:32 [SPEAKER_01]: The last five years, he was a Christian, great grandpa, you would have loved to hang out with after the church service, completely different than the past 80 years, the jerk drinker that everyone had known.
01:31:32 --> 01:31:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Why do I bring that guy?
01:31:33 --> 01:31:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, if you're going to bring up John Flavel, you have to tell that story because it's amazing that with the John Flavel, I think die is about two years before this two years after preaching that sermon, but he brings a person to Christ.
01:31:45 --> 01:31:51 [SPEAKER_01]: that heard the sermon in the 1600s, like in the eve of the Revolutionary War, something crazy.
01:31:51 --> 01:31:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It was crazy to think about what God can use to bring you to Christ and the power of the Word.
01:31:55 --> 01:31:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you're out there, if you're sharing the gospel, so I'm gonna share it anyway now.
01:31:59 --> 01:32:02 [SPEAKER_00]: You never know, maybe 85 years, that conversation will replay in their head.
01:32:02 --> 01:32:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But Johnville was also a minister in a fishing home, and he said there are lots of stories of these fishermen going out, getting into a crazy storm and coming to Christ or having a supernatural experience and believing in God and promising God, you get me out of the storm I'll believe in you.
01:32:22 --> 01:32:29 [SPEAKER_01]: in a few months or years go by and they're back to living the way they were before because it was a promise they only made in the moment.
01:32:29 --> 01:32:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a flow velocity.
01:32:30 --> 01:32:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It'd be really careful with these types because they're seeing this, like not the supernatural war, but they're seeing the power of God of close in the way a lot of people on land aren't going to and it causes them to have moments of belief in God, but that doesn't turn into moments of faith, if that makes sense.
01:32:46 --> 01:32:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is a wild thing to kind of think about.
01:32:51 --> 01:32:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And you could apply that to Chocolat.
01:32:54 --> 01:32:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that what Chocolat was doing?
01:32:55 --> 01:33:02 [SPEAKER_01]: He was seeing those moments of God's power and it was inspiring moments of belief, maybe.
01:33:03 --> 01:33:10 [SPEAKER_01]: But when I look at what little scraps of God we see coming from him, I see a person who seems to be seeing something deeper.
01:33:10 --> 01:33:14 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I look at that verse from Job, why did that verse clean to him?
01:33:14 --> 01:33:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, it's what he's looking around him.
01:33:16 --> 01:33:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's also saying like, it's me.
01:33:19 --> 01:33:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know it's hard,
01:33:21 --> 01:33:22 [SPEAKER_01]: This verse is true.
01:33:23 --> 01:33:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm living it.
01:33:24 --> 01:33:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I know that there's something to this book because I'm living the icy wounds and frozen surface thing like that.
01:33:30 --> 01:33:32 [SPEAKER_01]: He cleansed that because he's seen it.
01:33:32 --> 01:33:33 [SPEAKER_01]: He also had some songs with them.
01:33:33 --> 01:33:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So it wasn't just that one verse.
01:33:36 --> 01:33:38 [SPEAKER_01]: He's having this service while the boat sings right there.
01:33:38 --> 01:33:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know about that one.
01:33:39 --> 01:33:40 [SPEAKER_01]: That was a pretty cool one.
01:33:40 --> 01:33:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's mentioning these things.
01:33:42 --> 01:33:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It seems realer to him and not.
01:33:46 --> 01:33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a sailor.
01:33:46 --> 01:33:47 [SPEAKER_01]: He's an Arctic explorer.
01:33:48 --> 01:33:50 [SPEAKER_01]: How much of that is going to come out?
01:33:50 --> 01:33:51 [SPEAKER_01]: How many people have even been asking him?
01:33:52 --> 01:33:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it opinions about God and his faith?
01:33:54 --> 01:33:55 [SPEAKER_01]: How many people were even caring?
01:33:55 --> 01:33:58 [SPEAKER_01]: In the 1900s during that time during World War I, I mean, it wasn't.
01:33:58 --> 01:34:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Was it a priority to get to find out if he wasn't Christian?
01:34:02 --> 01:34:03 [SPEAKER_01]: necessarily or not?
01:34:04 --> 01:34:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's interesting because both him and Worsley tell the story of feeling like somebody else was there, even though they were two different people, they didn't talk about the time, but later on they both sound out, they were feeling the same thing at the same time.
01:34:16 --> 01:34:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's just what the John Philvel is saying, maybe it really is just that.
01:34:20 --> 01:34:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, sailors say things in the moment, but they don't mean it, but if a shackle ten feels different in his character certainly would argue that he was more than just an average sailor that he genuinely, he certainly has the character that we're looking for.
01:34:34 --> 01:34:38 [SPEAKER_01]: What his words, what little bit we have, some of it certainly winds up.
01:34:38 --> 01:34:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't think of anything that winds up against it.
01:34:40 --> 01:34:46 [SPEAKER_01]: unless he really did, she known as wife, which we don't see a ton of evidence for in drinking a milk.
01:34:46 --> 01:34:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, it's not great, but there are Christians who drink too much or that does happen in sailors, aren't notorious for it.
01:34:51 --> 01:34:55 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, I saw that we want that, but I mean, I don't think that would disqualify you.
01:34:57 --> 01:35:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Since I have nothing going against him, I have a lot going for him.
01:35:00 --> 01:35:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to not be as cynical as John told that.
01:35:02 --> 01:35:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I think at least, he probably was seen as they, but I don't think that that's what we're seeing with shackles.
01:35:07 --> 01:35:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I'm leaning
01:35:09 --> 01:35:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I just choose to believe it's like I choose to believe that ad.
01:35:14 --> 01:35:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I'm being blind and just really wishing that guy as cool as this will be going to happen.
01:35:18 --> 01:35:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But at least as much as I can tell seems like there's evidence.
01:35:22 --> 01:35:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Some hints of evidence there.
01:35:25 --> 01:35:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I had that same quote like we've been saying it like I choose to believe.
01:35:29 --> 01:35:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I choose to believe that that Shekleton could have very well been a Christian and like I already said like and in the very least we can definitely learn something from his life, the way he treated his men, the way he handled situations, and the way he persevered and then the way that he also described that God helped him through these moments like the fourth
01:35:55 --> 01:35:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:35:56 --> 01:35:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a beautiful story.
01:35:57 --> 01:36:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a great story and we'd love to hear from you in the comments.
01:36:00 --> 01:36:06 [SPEAKER_00]: If you have any more thoughts on this, if you, you know, joining on the discussion.
01:36:06 --> 01:36:09 [SPEAKER_00]: We really want to do those comment episodes.
01:36:09 --> 01:36:09 [SPEAKER_00]: We want to learn more.
01:36:10 --> 01:36:12 [SPEAKER_00]: We've just opened the book, opened the discussion.
01:36:12 --> 01:36:14 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't want to close it at any point.
01:36:14 --> 01:36:22 [SPEAKER_00]: We want to keep learning from all these men that we've talked about this entire season, all the eight episodes.
01:36:23 --> 01:36:25 [SPEAKER_00]: All of our season one here on Chris Cheranad.
01:36:25 --> 01:36:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So jump into comments and talk with us we would love to hear from you.
01:36:31 --> 01:36:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Kind of crazy, I think this is going to be the last official Christian or not episode of this eight episode season where you came together, it's kind of weird.
01:36:39 --> 01:36:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And you would think about, I feel like we're coming to the end of our own expedition here, and we'll find out like Shockelton if it's a giant down here.
01:36:46 --> 01:36:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Or not as you release these episodes, but yeah, this is been,
01:36:51 --> 01:36:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I've really enjoyed making these episodes.
01:36:53 --> 01:36:54 [SPEAKER_00]: It's been fun reading their stories.
01:36:54 --> 01:37:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been fun thinking about people that I never would have thought about And to try to wrestle with that question like, okay, okay, it's that all these things going on Where are they Christians or not?
01:37:03 --> 01:37:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And yes, God knows who has to who's gonna be in heaven?
01:37:07 --> 01:37:15 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not I'm not trying any way to take away from that, but just the wrestle the the mystery the the lie Sadly the lack of not knowing a lot of cases.
01:37:15 --> 01:37:17 [SPEAKER_01]: We just can't be certain one way or the other
01:37:17 --> 01:37:19 [SPEAKER_01]: we're just trying to figure it out.
01:37:19 --> 01:37:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's fun.
01:37:20 --> 01:37:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoy it.
01:37:20 --> 01:37:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope that the listeners are obviously sharing it and subscribing it and all that stuff that they hope that you are enjoying listening to it and thinking about it as much as I have been because it has been it's made me think about a lot of things.
01:37:32 --> 01:37:33 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been pretty cool.
01:37:33 --> 01:37:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I totally agree, and well, we actually didn't tell you beforehand that it was going to be in eight episodes, season.
01:37:40 --> 01:37:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't know, but like, sort of.
01:37:42 --> 01:37:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's a me, indeed.
01:37:45 --> 01:37:45 [SPEAKER_00]: We're running out of time.
01:37:46 --> 01:37:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Some people have some traveling to do, have to go back home for a couple of months.
01:37:53 --> 01:37:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's Troy.
01:37:54 --> 01:37:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's Troy's going back to the end.
01:37:55 --> 01:37:57 [SPEAKER_00]: He's got to work in his Dutch.
01:37:57 --> 01:37:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty bad.
01:37:58 --> 01:37:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's terrible.
01:37:59 --> 01:38:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Pretty low.
01:38:00 --> 01:38:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I can say, oh, no, I learned the word the other day, but now I forgot what it was.
01:38:04 --> 01:38:04 [SPEAKER_01]: No, what was it?
01:38:04 --> 01:38:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It was like peppers.
01:38:06 --> 01:38:07 [SPEAKER_01]: You have a funny, no, no, it was not peppers.
01:38:08 --> 01:38:09 [SPEAKER_01]: It was a word.
01:38:09 --> 01:38:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I learned it from a student.
01:38:10 --> 01:38:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
01:38:11 --> 01:38:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Pepper is this bapty guy.
01:38:12 --> 01:38:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Is that?
01:38:12 --> 01:38:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but it wasn't a loom for it.
01:38:13 --> 01:38:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But it was something like that.
01:38:15 --> 01:38:15 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no.
01:38:15 --> 01:38:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It was potatoes.
01:38:19 --> 01:38:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I know not three and then land apples.
01:38:21 --> 01:38:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was super funny.
01:38:22 --> 01:38:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So do you know it still?
01:38:23 --> 01:38:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I know.
01:38:24 --> 01:38:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember that.
01:38:24 --> 01:38:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I just remember they were called.
01:38:25 --> 01:38:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Addable.
01:38:26 --> 01:38:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Addable.
01:38:27 --> 01:38:29 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
01:38:29 --> 01:38:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So art is land and then apple is apple.
01:38:31 --> 01:38:32 [SPEAKER_00]: So art, apple.
01:38:32 --> 01:38:32 [SPEAKER_01]: card, apples.
01:38:33 --> 01:38:33 [SPEAKER_01]: There you go.
01:38:33 --> 01:38:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And your episode, enter to shackles and you learn that in the Netherlands.
01:38:37 --> 01:38:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Theators are called rain apples, which is pretty neat there.
01:38:40 --> 01:38:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And maybe there's sea apples and maybe shackles and found them with that.
01:38:45 --> 01:38:46 [SPEAKER_00]: No, we're not gonna.
01:38:46 --> 01:39:02 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
01:39:04 --> 01:39:22 [SPEAKER_00]: season and also if you have people that you say like hey I think this guy is really known to be a Christian or this guy no one knows he's a Christian sent them in because we we have some ideas but we're you know we'd love to hear from you for me if you're looking forward to season two and you're wondering what kind of episode I mean I'm thinking Abraham Lincoln Winston Churchill
01:39:23 --> 01:39:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Dr. Veski, Jonathan Swift, like I can think of so many people who would make great episodes of in the future.
01:39:30 --> 01:39:33 [SPEAKER_01]: We also have a, you know, we want to do our spin-off show.
01:39:33 --> 01:39:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So we, we, we, we, we thought of that one.
01:39:35 --> 01:39:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we want to,
01:39:36 --> 01:39:38 [SPEAKER_00]: You want to announce it right here?
01:39:38 --> 01:39:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, my eyes will give us something to look at.
01:39:40 --> 01:39:42 [SPEAKER_01]: So we hope in season two to also bring you.
01:39:42 --> 01:39:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Man, I love it.
01:39:43 --> 01:39:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I love it's ready.
01:39:44 --> 01:39:45 [SPEAKER_01]: No, and then right, it's not ready.
01:39:45 --> 01:39:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's okay.
01:39:45 --> 01:39:47 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a teaser for me.
01:39:47 --> 01:39:48 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot easier.
01:39:48 --> 01:39:49 [SPEAKER_01]: It depends on how this one goes.
01:39:49 --> 01:39:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We have a spin-off.
01:39:50 --> 01:39:52 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a very dangerous fit-off to do.
01:39:53 --> 01:39:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So maybe we should just leave it with this.
01:39:54 --> 01:39:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have lots of ideas and lots of ideas for the future.
01:39:56 --> 01:39:57 [SPEAKER_01]: But send us some more.
01:39:57 --> 01:40:00 [SPEAKER_01]: If you have some really great people here on the No, No, No, you gotta do this guy, let us know.
01:40:00 --> 01:40:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And we have done all guys, but we are not exclusive.
01:40:03 --> 01:40:06 [SPEAKER_01]: So I think there are probably some girls that are absolutely
01:40:06 --> 01:40:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I only actually realized as we were doing this episode that we'd only picked man, but this is not There's nothing sex is going on here.
01:40:13 --> 01:40:14 [SPEAKER_01]: We just only picked minutes.
01:40:14 --> 01:40:15 [SPEAKER_01]: There you are.
01:40:15 --> 01:40:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So if you have some great ideas Send them our way so the season two can be just as enriching the filling and hopefully challenging and convicting and Like I said, this will only last 90 cs between season one and two if all goes well, that'll be some common Okay, well, my name is Mark my name is Troy and this was christian dot season one